Discussion:
Disappointing Lupin Photo
(too old to reply)
gjw
2004-02-16 18:03:15 UTC
Permalink
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
Loading Image...
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?


Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
rooters:
Loading Image...


And finally, a portrait of Harry with messy hair, as the books
describe him:
Loading Image...

Now if only they would get his eyes the right color... In a world of
CGI magic (not to mention contact lenses), how hard could it be to
make his eyes green??
Allyson Robinson
2004-02-16 18:21:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Hell no. Don't they know he's supposed to be sexy? ;-)
Post by gjw
Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide3.jpg
Bah. Cute picture though.
Post by gjw
And finally, a portrait of Harry with messy hair, as the books
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide5.jpg
Now if only they would get his eyes the right color... In a world of
CGI magic (not to mention contact lenses), how hard could it be to
make his eyes green??
I have always wondered that.





--------------------

Allyson Robinson
lukeandallyson.com
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-16 18:51:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.j
pg
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Hell no. Don't they know he's supposed to be sexy? ;-)
I'd settle for him not looking like a complete twit...

Catherine Johnson. Sirius Black, OTOH looks great.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"His one true superpower: He's crazy."
-CN's Web Site, about Robin from _Teen Titans_.
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-16 18:49:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Urge to kill... rising...
He might look a lot better of he pulled that caterpillar off his lip. Has
that look EVER worked for ANYONE?
Post by gjw
Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide3.jpg

OMG! They're sitting there talking! IT MUST BE LURVE!!!
Please, a better "evidence" picture has been around since almost the
beginning of filming:
Loading Image...
And besides, hasn't JKR herself said it's not gonna happen?
Post by gjw
And finally, a portrait of Harry with messy hair, as the books
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide5.jpg

'Bout freakin' time, too. I love his messy hair. I hope the subsequent
directors (and actors, if Daniel leaves/gets replaced) keep that trait.
And what about this pic of him on the Firebolt:
Loading Image...
Are those goggles?
<Ze goggles! Zhey do nuzzink!>
Post by gjw
Now if only they would get his eyes the right color... In a world
LOL!
Sorry, I'm just reminded of a comedian making fun of all those bad movie
trailers that start out like that. "In a world..."
Post by gjw
of CGI magic (not to mention contact lenses),
I've heard he tried contacts for the first film. Some people just can't
stand wearing them, especially if they don't usually.
I DO wonder about the CGI though...

Catherine Johnson, who points out that Alan Rickman *does* wear contacts to
play Snape. Just a little FYI.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?"
"I think so, Brain, but who wants to see _Snow White and the Seven
Samurai_?"
Allyson Robinson
2004-02-16 19:05:10 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:49:55 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Urge to kill... rising...
He might look a lot better of he pulled that caterpillar off his lip. Has
that look EVER worked for ANYONE?
It's just so... foppish. The moustache & hairdo (because a previously
unemployed werewolf described as "shabby" would _really_ style his hair
that way) makes me think of only pompous characters-- like the maitre-d'
in _Ferris Bueller_, or the duke in _Moulin Rouge_.


--------------------

Allyson Robinson
lukeandallyson.com
Ze alluring ailurophile
2004-02-16 21:29:11 UTC
Permalink
Subject: Re: Disappointing Lupin Photo
Date: 2/16/2004 2:05 PM Eastern Standard Time
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:49:55 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Urge to kill... rising...
He might look a lot better of he pulled that caterpillar off his lip. Has
that look EVER worked for ANYONE?
It's just so... foppish. The moustache & hairdo (because a previously
unemployed werewolf described as "shabby" would _really_ style his hair
that way) makes me think of only pompous characters-- like the maitre-d'
in _Ferris Bueller_, or the duke in _Moulin Rouge_.
Did you see Thewlis in Dragonheart? While he played the role _exceedingly_
well, I now always envision him as a self serving git.
--------------------
Allyson Robinson
lukeandallyson.com
Jennifer
2004-02-16 22:05:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ze alluring ailurophile
Did you see Thewlis in Dragonheart? While he played the role _exceedingly_
well, I now always envision him as a self serving git.
Dragonheart is one of my daughter's favorite movies ... We watch it
regularly. I know already that I'm going to have a ton of trouble
separating Remus and Einon.
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-16 23:59:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jennifer
Post by Ze alluring ailurophile
Did you see Thewlis in Dragonheart? While he played the
role _exceedingly_ well, I now always envision him as a self
serving git.
Dragonheart is one of my daughter's favorite movies ... We
watch it regularly. I know already that I'm going to have a
ton of trouble separating Remus and Einon.
And Jason Isaacs is in it. If they keep this same cast all the way through
GoF, that will be *three* movies Isaacs and Thewlis have been in together.
And they have a scene together in OtP (the attack on the MoM).
(The third movie is called _Divorcing Jack_, btw)
What can I say, I saw Isaacs in CoS, and got interested in him. Now I'm a
totally Jason fangirl... ^_^

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"Felton, only you could keep such a good brain under such a bad hat."
-King Einon, _Dragonheart_.
PamIler
2004-02-17 03:14:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
(The third movie is called _Divorcing Jack_, btw)
What can I say, I saw Isa
And Rickman directed it!
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-17 03:36:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by PamIler
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
(The third movie is called _Divorcing Jack_, btw)
And Rickman directed it!
Nope. A bloke named David Caffrey did.

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"I've got twelve Vampire Slayers behind me, and not one of them has ever
dated you."
-Andrew, _Angel_.
unknown
2004-02-17 03:54:08 UTC
Permalink
What? Alan Rickman has only directed one movie, The Winter Guest in
1997 which he also wrote.

The directors were:

Divorcing Jack by David Caffrey
Dragonheart by Rob Cohen
Post by PamIler
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
(The third movie is called _Divorcing Jack_, btw)
What can I say, I saw Isa
And Rickman directed it!
Dragon Friend
2004-02-17 10:42:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by PamIler
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
(The third movie is called _Divorcing Jack_, btw)
What can I say, I saw Isa
And Rickman directed it!
Afraid not, Alan Rickman has only, so far, directed one film and that was
"The Winter Guest" in 1997, he also made a brief uncredited appearance in
the film.

Dragon Friend
--
Alan Rickman/Juliet Stevenson/Janeane Garofalo/Mike Binder fans please sign
this petition to get a great comedy film
http://www.searchforjohngissing.com/ released
http://www.petitiononline.com/JG022004/petition.html
Simone Kessler
2004-02-20 12:51:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Allyson Robinson
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:49:55 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jp
g
Post by Allyson Robinson
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Urge to kill... rising...
He might look a lot better of he pulled that caterpillar off his lip.
Has
Post by Allyson Robinson
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
that look EVER worked for ANYONE?
It's just so... foppish. The moustache & hairdo (because a previously
unemployed werewolf described as "shabby" would _really_ style his hair
that way) makes me think of only pompous characters-- like the maitre-d'
in _Ferris Bueller_, or the duke in _Moulin Rouge_.
Actually, it makes me think more of a schoolmaster from a 1930s movie - sort
of "Goodbye Mr Chips".
Anyway, I think it's horrible. Not that I'm surprised. The casting is so
very disappointing, both for Lupin and for Sirius.
Yuck!

Simone
Post by Allyson Robinson
--------------------
Allyson Robinson
lukeandallyson.com
Tim Behrendsen
2004-02-16 19:27:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by gjw
Now if only they would get his eyes the right color... In a world
LOL!
Sorry, I'm just reminded of a comedian making fun of all those bad movie
trailers that start out like that. "In a world..."
Post by gjw
of CGI magic (not to mention contact lenses),
I've heard he tried contacts for the first film. Some people just can't
stand wearing them, especially if they don't usually.
I DO wonder about the CGI though...
I heard once that they ran out of time to do the CGI green eyes for the first film. I'm
really hoping they decide to screw continuity and give him green eyes in PoA or Gof, and
then go back and colorize the previous movies as well.

Now, looking at my 2003 Harry Potter calendar, the July picture seems to show Harry with
emerald green eyes. On the other hand, September (and the other months) shows him with his
normal blue eyes. So I dunno. Maybe whoever did the layout on the July picture is a fan
who thought, "Screw it. I'm fixing this one. The eyes should be green, dang it!" :D
gjw
2004-02-17 02:10:02 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:49:55 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide3.jpg
OMG! They're sitting there talking! IT MUST BE LURVE!!!
Please, a better "evidence" picture has been around since almost the
http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/images/2003/08/PoAHiResHermioneHarry.jpg
That just looks to me like he's trying to shield her. The other photos
looks more friendly (although it's anyone's guess if it's intended to)
...
Post by gjw
And besides, hasn't JKR herself said it's not gonna happen?
No she hasn't. Cite the source please, if you can find it.
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
And finally, a portrait of Harry with messy hair, as the books
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide5.jpg
'Bout freakin' time, too. I love his messy hair. I hope the subsequent
directors (and actors, if Daniel leaves/gets replaced) keep that trait.
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide6.jpg
Are those goggles?
<Ze goggles! Zhey do nuzzink!>
I hate that photos. Looks like a lame version of Robin, the Boy
Wonder...
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
Now if only they would get his eyes the right color... In a world
LOL!
Sorry, I'm just reminded of a comedian making fun of all those bad movie
trailers that start out like that. "In a world..."
Post by gjw
of CGI magic (not to mention contact lenses),
I've heard he tried contacts for the first film. Some people just can't
stand wearing them, especially if they don't usually.
I DO wonder about the CGI though...
And they wouldn't even have to do it in every scene, just in the
close-ups where his eye color is obvious.

If Rowling hadn't made such a fuss about Harry's green eyes, I
wouldn't mind. But since she did...
Allyson Robinson
2004-02-17 02:30:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Allyson Robinson
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:49:55 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide3.jpg
OMG! They're sitting there talking! IT MUST BE LURVE!!!
Please, a better "evidence" picture has been around since almost the
http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/images/2003/08/PoAHiResHermioneHarry.jpg
That just looks to me like he's trying to shield her. The other photos
looks more friendly (although it's anyone's guess if it's intended to)
...
Post by gjw
And besides, hasn't JKR herself said it's not gonna happen?
No she hasn't. Cite the source please, if you can find it.
She pretty much has. Here are a few quotes located on mugglenet.com:

Couric: "Any snogging with Hermione?"
Rowling: [surprised] "Harry and Hermione! Do you think so?" -- From
Katie Couric's June 2003 interview with JK Rowling

"Harry and Hermione are very platonic [platonic means nonsexual]
friends. But I won't answer for anyone else. Nudge, nudge, wink, wink."
-- From a National Press Club Luncheon chat with JK Rowling, October
1999)

Q: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione
during the last half of Goblet of Fire?
A: "Yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical
boy." -- From a BarnesandNoble.com chat with JK Rowling


You can read more at:
http://www.mugglenet.com/books/couples-ronhermione.shtml

<snip to end>


--------------------

Allyson Robinson
lukeandallyson.com
gjw
2004-02-17 07:48:30 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:30:07 -0800, Allyson Robinson
Post by Allyson Robinson
Post by Allyson Robinson
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:49:55 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
And besides, hasn't JKR herself said it's not gonna happen?
No she hasn't. Cite the source please, if you can find it.
Couric: "Any snogging with Hermione?"
Rowling: [surprised] "Harry and Hermione! Do you think so?" -- From
That is a question, not an answer. Which makes me suspicious, as if
she's trying to avoid directly answering the reporter's question.
Post by Allyson Robinson
"Harry and Hermione are very platonic [platonic means nonsexual]
friends. But I won't answer for anyone else. Nudge, nudge, wink, wink."
-- From a National Press Club Luncheon chat with JK Rowling, October
1999)
I don't think it's any secret that up until now, Harry and Hermione
have had a purely platonic relationship. So far, Harry has been
attracted to no one but Cho. (And since we see everything through
Harry's eyes, we have no way of knowing if Hermione is attracted to
him or not.) But we are talking about what will happen in the
remaining books. Cho is now history, and Harry will probably start
noticing other girls now.
Post by Allyson Robinson
Q: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione
during the last half of Goblet of Fire?
A: "Yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical
boy." -- From a BarnesandNoble.com chat with JK Rowling
There is no question that something is going on in GoF. The problem is
that it is probably one-sided. Ron, who always thought of Hermione as
a platonic friend (and occasional pain in the neck) notices that she
is a girl (after her Cinderella transformation before the Yule Ball).
Ron is no doubt slightly smitten on Hermione. The problem is that it's
quite possible that Hermione may not feel the same for Ron.

To sum up, nothing that Rowling has said would rule out a
Harry/Hermione match-up in the remaining books.
e.a.o.
2004-02-17 12:07:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:30:07 -0800, Allyson Robinson
Post by Allyson Robinson
Post by Allyson Robinson
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:49:55 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
And besides, hasn't JKR herself said it's not gonna happen?
No she hasn't. Cite the source please, if you can find it.
Couric: "Any snogging with Hermione?"
Rowling: [surprised] "Harry and Hermione! Do you think so?" -- From
That is a question, not an answer. Which makes me suspicious, as if
she's trying to avoid directly answering the reporter's question.
Post by Allyson Robinson
"Harry and Hermione are very platonic [platonic means nonsexual]
friends. But I won't answer for anyone else. Nudge, nudge, wink, wink."
-- From a National Press Club Luncheon chat with JK Rowling, October
1999)
I don't think it's any secret that up until now, Harry and Hermione
have had a purely platonic relationship. So far, Harry has been
attracted to no one but Cho. (And since we see everything through
Harry's eyes, we have no way of knowing if Hermione is attracted to
him or not.) But we are talking about what will happen in the
remaining books. Cho is now history, and Harry will probably start
noticing other girls now.
Post by Allyson Robinson
Q: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione
during the last half of Goblet of Fire?
A: "Yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical
boy." -- From a BarnesandNoble.com chat with JK Rowling
There is no question that something is going on in GoF. The problem is
that it is probably one-sided. Ron, who always thought of Hermione as
a platonic friend (and occasional pain in the neck) notices that she
is a girl (after her Cinderella transformation before the Yule Ball).
Ron is no doubt slightly smitten on Hermione. The problem is that it's
quite possible that Hermione may not feel the same for Ron.
To sum up, nothing that Rowling has said would rule out a
Harry/Hermione match-up in the remaining books.
Rowling never comes out and gives a straight answer to any question about
what will or won't happen in the future books. But you're kidding yourself
if you take these responses by Rowling as any indication other than that
Harry and Hermione will NEVER have a romantic relationship.
stark
2004-02-17 16:25:27 UTC
Permalink
Not like I really want to restart this debate now, but I feel the need to at
least supply the evidence...
Post by gjw
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:30:07 -0800, Allyson Robinson
Post by Allyson Robinson
Post by Allyson Robinson
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:49:55 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Couric: "Any snogging with Hermione?"
Rowling: [surprised] "Harry and Hermione! Do you think so?" -- From
That is a question, not an answer. Which makes me suspicious, as if
she's trying to avoid directly answering the reporter's question.
We have no known instances of Rowling every deceiving us with interview
answers. She has even said that she answers questions directly and
truthfully, except in cases where it might give away future plot, and then
she will simply avoid saying anything.

In the case of this question, the tone is the giveaway. The words "Do you
think so?" were said in a way that was meant to convey doubt and surprise
that anyone would think such a thing was a possibility.
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
"Harry and Hermione are very platonic [platonic means nonsexual]
friends. But I won't answer for anyone else. Nudge, nudge, wink, wink."
-- From a National Press Club Luncheon chat with JK Rowling, October
1999)
I don't think it's any secret that up until now, Harry and Hermione
have had a purely platonic relationship. So far, Harry has been
attracted to no one but Cho. (And since we see everything through
Harry's eyes, we have no way of knowing if Hermione is attracted to
him or not.) But we are talking about what will happen in the
remaining books. Cho is now history, and Harry will probably start
noticing other girls now.
We have unfiltered access to Harry's thoughts, and they are strictly
platonic toward Hermione. I'd define 'platonic' as "non-romantic". Harry
has no romantic feelings toward Hermione, and the plot doesn't seem even
remotely set up to easily accomidate such a thing.
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
Q: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione
during the last half of Goblet of Fire?
A: "Yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical
boy." -- From a BarnesandNoble.com chat with JK Rowling
There is no question that something is going on in GoF. The problem is
that it is probably one-sided. Ron, who always thought of Hermione as
a platonic friend (and occasional pain in the neck) notices that she
is a girl (after her Cinderella transformation before the Yule Ball).
Ron is no doubt slightly smitten on Hermione. The problem is that it's
quite possible that Hermione may not feel the same for Ron.
There are several occasions where we see hints that its not. There are a
number of occasions where Hermione expresses what any 12 year old will
identify as jealousy whenever Fleur gives any attention to Ron, or Ron to
Fleur. And the post-Ball argument is distinctly lacking in hypotheticals,
its Ron and Hermione arguing about each other.
Post by gjw
To sum up, nothing that Rowling has said would rule out a
Harry/Hermione match-up in the remaining books.
She's free to do whatever she wants, but to an impartial mind (which I
consider myself and several others I've discussed this with), it seems clear
at least that there is no current foundation for a Harry/Hermione
relationship, and a fairly strong set up for a Ron/Hermione relationship.
Other than that, there isn't much in the plot telling us about any other
relationships. Bill has Fleur (more or less), and it seems that Neville
likes Ginny.

So, yes, nothing she's said rules it out, but similarly, nothing she's said
has ruled out the possibility that Harry and Ron get together.
--
737461726B3A30322F31372F3034203131303923696E636C756465203C6373746469
6F3E0A23696E636C756465203C756E697374642E683E0A6D61696E28297B666F7228
6368617220632C693D2D313B7265616428302C26632C31293B69253D333429707269
6E74662822257325303258222C2B2B693D3D33343F225C6E223A22222C63293B7D0A
gjw
2004-02-17 21:11:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by stark
Not like I really want to restart this debate now, but I feel the need to at
least supply the evidence...
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
Couric: "Any snogging with Hermione?"
Rowling: [surprised] "Harry and Hermione! Do you think so?" -- From
That is a question, not an answer. Which makes me suspicious, as if
she's trying to avoid directly answering the reporter's question.
We have no known instances of Rowling every deceiving us with interview
answers. She has even said that she answers questions directly and
truthfully, except in cases where it might give away future plot, and then
she will simply avoid saying anything.
The point is, she did not give an answer. She answered the question
with a question. "Do /you/ think so?" If you choose to interpret that
as anything other than simple evasion, you're fooling yourself.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
I don't think it's any secret that up until now, Harry and Hermione
have had a purely platonic relationship. So far, Harry has been
attracted to no one but Cho. (And since we see everything through
Harry's eyes, we have no way of knowing if Hermione is attracted to
him or not.) But we are talking about what will happen in the
remaining books. Cho is now history, and Harry will probably start
noticing other girls now.
We have unfiltered access to Harry's thoughts, and they are strictly
platonic toward Hermione. I'd define 'platonic' as "non-romantic". Harry
has no romantic feelings toward Hermione, and the plot doesn't seem even
remotely set up to easily accomidate such a thing.
As I stated in the paragraph you were apparently responding to, up
until now Harry and Hermione's relationship has indeed been strictly
platonic. The key words are "up until now".

Harry didn't even think about girls until Cho, and he certainly wasn't
thinking about Hermione in any romantic sense when he was busy chasing
Cho. (I remember hearing Vivian Leigh say that she never noticed Clark
Gable romantically during the filming of "Gone With the Wind" because
she was in the middle of a romance with Laurence Olivier.) But the Cho
episode is over. Ron's relationship with Hermione was downplayed
(indeed almost ignored) in the last book. The playing field has been
cleared for the next chapter... If that's the way Rowling wants to
play it.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
Q: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione
during the last half of Goblet of Fire?
A: "Yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical
boy." -- From a BarnesandNoble.com chat with JK Rowling
There is no question that something is going on in GoF. The problem is
that it is probably one-sided. Ron, who always thought of Hermione as
a platonic friend (and occasional pain in the neck) notices that she
is a girl (after her Cinderella transformation before the Yule Ball).
Ron is no doubt slightly smitten on Hermione. The problem is that it's
quite possible that Hermione may not feel the same for Ron.
There are several occasions where we see hints that its not. There are a
number of occasions where Hermione expresses what any 12 year old will
identify as jealousy whenever Fleur gives any attention to Ron, or Ron to
Fleur. And the post-Ball argument is distinctly lacking in hypotheticals,
its Ron and Hermione arguing about each other.
You are simply seeing what you want to see. Hermione's reactions are
evidence of envy towards Fleur and her flirtatious ways, and of
general disgust that boys can be so easily manipulated by a pretty
face, more than they are of jealousy about either of the boys.

If you want to start citing scenes that probably don't mean anything,
the incident in which Krum tells Harry he believes that Harry &
Hermione are lovers, and the incident in which Hermione might have
deliberately sabotaged Harry's Valentines Day date with Cho, outweigh
any vague hints about her and Ron. But the reality is that Hermione
hasn't paid attention (romantically) to anyone by Krum.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
To sum up, nothing that Rowling has said would rule out a
Harry/Hermione match-up in the remaining books.
She's free to do whatever she wants, but to an impartial mind (which I
consider myself and several others I've discussed this with), it seems clear
at least that there is no current foundation for a Harry/Hermione
relationship, and a fairly strong set up for a Ron/Hermione relationship.
Both of the boys have spent the last five years virtually living with
Hermione - if that's not a foundation for a relationship, I don't know
what is.
Post by stark
So, yes, nothing she's said rules it out, but similarly, nothing she's said
has ruled out the possibility that Harry and Ron get together.
Now you're just being absurd...
Zebee Johnstone
2004-02-17 22:00:32 UTC
Permalink
In alt.fan.harry-potter on Tue, 17 Feb 2004 21:11:31 GMT
Post by gjw
Both of the boys have spent the last five years virtually living with
Hermione - if that's not a foundation for a relationship, I don't know
what is.
I've spent many years living in shared households with unattached men.

It might be the basis for a romantic relationship, but not in my
experience.

In my experience, what is, is a sort of spark that makes you look at
the bloke as something *other* than a friend, whereas all the others
still look like friends.

Sometimes that can be found by living with them, but it's my experience
that living with them stomps on that more than it creates it. I was
more interested in *ex* housemates later on than when they were
housemates.

Zebee
Tim Behrendsen
2004-02-17 22:59:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Post by stark
Not like I really want to restart this debate now, but I feel the need to at
least supply the evidence...
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
Couric: "Any snogging with Hermione?"
Rowling: [surprised] "Harry and Hermione! Do you think so?" -- From
That is a question, not an answer. Which makes me suspicious, as if
she's trying to avoid directly answering the reporter's question.
We have no known instances of Rowling every deceiving us with interview
answers. She has even said that she answers questions directly and
truthfully, except in cases where it might give away future plot, and then
she will simply avoid saying anything.
The point is, she did not give an answer. She answered the question
with a question. "Do /you/ think so?" If you choose to interpret that
as anything other than simple evasion, you're fooling yourself.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
I don't think it's any secret that up until now, Harry and Hermione
have had a purely platonic relationship. So far, Harry has been
attracted to no one but Cho. (And since we see everything through
Harry's eyes, we have no way of knowing if Hermione is attracted to
him or not.) But we are talking about what will happen in the
remaining books. Cho is now history, and Harry will probably start
noticing other girls now.
We have unfiltered access to Harry's thoughts, and they are strictly
platonic toward Hermione. I'd define 'platonic' as "non-romantic". Harry
has no romantic feelings toward Hermione, and the plot doesn't seem even
remotely set up to easily accomidate such a thing.
As I stated in the paragraph you were apparently responding to, up
until now Harry and Hermione's relationship has indeed been strictly
platonic. The key words are "up until now".
Harry didn't even think about girls until Cho, and he certainly wasn't
thinking about Hermione in any romantic sense when he was busy chasing
Cho. (I remember hearing Vivian Leigh say that she never noticed Clark
Gable romantically during the filming of "Gone With the Wind" because
she was in the middle of a romance with Laurence Olivier.) But the Cho
episode is over. Ron's relationship with Hermione was downplayed
(indeed almost ignored) in the last book. The playing field has been
cleared for the next chapter... If that's the way Rowling wants to
play it.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
Q: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione
during the last half of Goblet of Fire?
A: "Yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical
boy." -- From a BarnesandNoble.com chat with JK Rowling
There is no question that something is going on in GoF. The problem is
that it is probably one-sided. Ron, who always thought of Hermione as
a platonic friend (and occasional pain in the neck) notices that she
is a girl (after her Cinderella transformation before the Yule Ball).
Ron is no doubt slightly smitten on Hermione. The problem is that it's
quite possible that Hermione may not feel the same for Ron.
There are several occasions where we see hints that its not. There are a
number of occasions where Hermione expresses what any 12 year old will
identify as jealousy whenever Fleur gives any attention to Ron, or Ron to
Fleur. And the post-Ball argument is distinctly lacking in hypotheticals,
its Ron and Hermione arguing about each other.
You are simply seeing what you want to see. Hermione's reactions are
evidence of envy towards Fleur and her flirtatious ways, and of
general disgust that boys can be so easily manipulated by a pretty
face, more than they are of jealousy about either of the boys.
Not the way I read it. Hermione gets irritated specifically about Ron, but not about
Harry.
Post by gjw
If you want to start citing scenes that probably don't mean anything,
the incident in which Krum tells Harry he believes that Harry &
Hermione are lovers,
Actually, this is evidence against. Krum tells Harry that Hermione mentions Harry a lot,
which is the last thing a teenager would typically do about someone they like.
Post by gjw
and the incident in which Hermione might have
deliberately sabotaged Harry's Valentines Day date with Cho, outweigh
any vague hints about her and Ron.
This is not valid, since Hermione had no other way she could have arranged the meeting.
Post by gjw
But the reality is that Hermione hasn't paid attention (romantically) to anyone by Krum.
Well, except for the fact that she kissed Ron for good luck in OotP (which is much
different from Harry's kiss in GoF, which was in the context of sympathy).
Post by gjw
Post by stark
So, yes, nothing she's said rules it out, but similarly, nothing she's said
has ruled out the possibility that Harry and Ron get together.
Now you're just being absurd...
Not that it's going to happen, but we have more evidence for a Harry/Ron paring than we do
Harry/Hermione. Ron was the one Harry would miss the most in GoF, but on the other hand in
GoF, we had (paraphrase), "Harry liked Hermione very much, but there was a lot less
laughter and a lot more trips to the library when Hermione was your best friend."

Of course, JKR can write anything she wants, but so far the series is littered with hints
about Ron and Hermione, and there is zilch for Harry and Hermione.

The ultimate argument against is really literary. Family is the most important thing to
Harry, and if JKR was going to set up a future for Harry and Hermione, then we would know
a lot more about her family. I know some people don't like the "One Big Happy Weasley
Family" scenerio, but it's the only one that makes literary sense (assuming Harry lives).
gjw
2004-02-18 07:44:59 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:59:21 -0800, "Tim Behrendsen"
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
You are simply seeing what you want to see. Hermione's reactions are
evidence of envy towards Fleur and her flirtatious ways, and of
general disgust that boys can be so easily manipulated by a pretty
face, more than they are of jealousy about either of the boys.
Not the way I read it. Hermione gets irritated specifically about Ron, but not about
Harry.
That's not how I see it. (Not that Ron isn't irritating at times...)
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
If you want to start citing scenes that probably don't mean anything,
the incident in which Krum tells Harry he believes that Harry &
Hermione are lovers,
Actually, this is evidence against. Krum tells Harry that Hermione mentions Harry a lot,
which is the last thing a teenager would typically do about someone they like.
I disagree. When people get a crush on someone, they often can't stop
talking about anyone BUT that person. Simply because they are always
on their mind, and one tends to talk about what is on one's mind.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
and the incident in which Hermione might have
deliberately sabotaged Harry's Valentines Day date with Cho, outweigh
any vague hints about her and Ron.
This is not valid, since Hermione had no other way she could have arranged the meeting.
Perhaps. Or perhaps it was just a clever way of killing two birds with
one stone. Hermione is not socially naive nor is she ignorant of the
way Cho was likely to react to that sort of setup...
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
But the reality is that Hermione hasn't paid attention (romantically) to anyone by Krum.
Well, except for the fact that she kissed Ron for good luck in OotP (which is much
different from Harry's kiss in GoF, which was in the context of sympathy).
Both kisses were platonic, and tell us nothing.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Of course, JKR can write anything she wants, but so far the series is littered with hints
about Ron and Hermione, and there is zilch for Harry and Hermione.
Untrue. But even if it were, by now we should know that JKR usually
lets us think she's heading in one direction when she's really heading
in another. (She spent the entire first book convincing us that Snape
was the main villain...)
Post by Tim Behrendsen
The ultimate argument against is really literary. Family is the most important thing to
Harry, and if JKR was going to set up a future for Harry and Hermione, then we would know
a lot more about her family. I know some people don't like the "One Big Happy Weasley
Family" scenerio, but it's the only one that makes literary sense (assuming Harry lives).
Again, I disagree. Both films and literature have a long history of
having the main girl end up with the main guy. Sidekicks rarely get
the girl. The reason is simple: readers/viewers identify with the main
character in a story, so when it comes time for the girl to choose,
she (in effect) chooses the reader/viewer by choosing the main man.

Speaking of a happy future, Ron & Hermione have nothing in common.
Hermione is a mature (for her age), intelligent girl from an
all-Muggle family. Ron is an immature joker from an all-wizard clan.
The only reason Ron is paying attention to Hermione now (after years
of not being able to get along with her) is that his hormones are
kicking in, so he's temporarily overlooking their obvious differences.
That kind of physical thing can lead to interesting short-term
affairs, but in the long run it's a serious mismatch which would lead
to disaster.

And there is nothing mandating that Harry automatically inherit a
giant family. He and his future wife (whoever she may be) can create
their own family... and still have a lot of close friends in the
Weasleys.

Personally, though, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Harry (and
the rest of the trio) still remain unattached at the end of the
series. They are still quite young. JKR only has two books left to go,
she almost ignored the intra-trio romance angle last time, and I'm not
sure she still has time to bring a serious romance to fruition in the
remaining books.
Tim Behrendsen
2004-02-18 17:34:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:59:21 -0800, "Tim Behrendsen"
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
If you want to start citing scenes that probably don't mean anything,
the incident in which Krum tells Harry he believes that Harry &
Hermione are lovers,
Actually, this is evidence against. Krum tells Harry that Hermione mentions Harry a lot,
which is the last thing a teenager would typically do about someone they like.
I disagree. When people get a crush on someone, they often can't stop
talking about anyone BUT that person. Simply because they are always
on their mind, and one tends to talk about what is on one's mind.
Maybe to someone who is a close friend, but I personally don't go blabbing about my secret
crushes to anyone who'll listen, particularly to someone of the opposite sex who seems to
be showing some interest in me.
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
and the incident in which Hermione might have
deliberately sabotaged Harry's Valentines Day date with Cho, outweigh
any vague hints about her and Ron.
This is not valid, since Hermione had no other way she could have arranged the meeting.
Perhaps. Or perhaps it was just a clever way of killing two birds with
one stone. Hermione is not socially naive nor is she ignorant of the
way Cho was likely to react to that sort of setup...
Except that it was Harry that screwed it up. It wouldn't have been a big deal if Harry had
just explained things a little better. Hermione might have predicted that somehow Harry
would screw it up, but it was a rather overly elaborate plan. If Hermione wanted to screw
up Cho, she could have done it much simpler ways. At the very least, she could have
withheld her (good) advice to Harry.
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
But the reality is that Hermione hasn't paid attention (romantically) to anyone by Krum.
Well, except for the fact that she kissed Ron for good luck in OotP (which is much
different from Harry's kiss in GoF, which was in the context of sympathy).
Both kisses were platonic, and tell us nothing.
So then why did she only kiss Ron good luck, and not Harry? And more importantly, what is
JKR trying to convey in that scene by having Hermione kiss Ron at all? And what is she
trying to convey by Ron's reaction? Ron certainly didn't react like it was platonic, and
Hermione would know that it would be interpreted that way.
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Of course, JKR can write anything she wants, but so far the series is littered with hints
about Ron and Hermione, and there is zilch for Harry and Hermione.
Untrue. But even if it were, by now we should know that JKR usually
lets us think she's heading in one direction when she's really heading
in another. (She spent the entire first book convincing us that Snape
was the main villain...)
There's a difference between character development and plot development. JKR does red
herrings for her mysteries (plot development), but so far hasn't done anything like that
for her character development. The reason is that for characters to be believable, she
can't continually twist around their motivations, otherwise we lose a sense of them.
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
The ultimate argument against is really literary. Family is the most important thing to
Harry, and if JKR was going to set up a future for Harry and Hermione, then we would know
a lot more about her family. I know some people don't like the "One Big Happy Weasley
Family" scenerio, but it's the only one that makes literary sense (assuming Harry lives).
Again, I disagree. Both films and literature have a long history of
having the main girl end up with the main guy. Sidekicks rarely get
the girl. The reason is simple: readers/viewers identify with the main
character in a story, so when it comes time for the girl to choose,
she (in effect) chooses the reader/viewer by choosing the main man.
The problem with this theory is that Hermione is a sidekick, not a main girl. There is no
"leading lady" so far in the story. Both Ron and Hermione equally orbit Harry as
characters.
Post by gjw
Speaking of a happy future, Ron & Hermione have nothing in common.
Hermione is a mature (for her age), intelligent girl from an
all-Muggle family. Ron is an immature joker from an all-wizard clan.
Ron is 15. Not surprising that he's less mature than Hermione, as girls usually mature
faster. But note that his maturity greatly increased in OotP over GoF. Ron's growth has
been a slow arc.
Post by gjw
The only reason Ron is paying attention to Hermione now (after years
of not being able to get along with her) is that his hormones are
kicking in, so he's temporarily overlooking their obvious differences.
That kind of physical thing can lead to interesting short-term
affairs, but in the long run it's a serious mismatch which would lead
to disaster.
The secret to a good relationship is having personalities that complement each other, not
being carbon copies. Ron helps Hermione loosen up and have fun, and Hermione helps Ron
take life more seriously.

If you want to think of a disaster relationship, consider Harry and Hermione. Hermione
would nag Harry, causing Harry to pull into himself. Hermione gets frustrated at Harry's
lack of communication. Ron is much more equipped to handle Hermione's nagging.
Post by gjw
And there is nothing mandating that Harry automatically inherit a
giant family. He and his future wife (whoever she may be) can create
their own family... and still have a lot of close friends in the
Weasleys.
Certainly they could, but again I go back to literary structure. If JKR wanted to
foreshadow a future life for Harry and Hermione, then she would spend more time on it. At
the very least, she would show Harry /meeting/ Hermione's parents!
Post by gjw
Personally, though, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Harry (and
the rest of the trio) still remain unattached at the end of the
series. They are still quite young. JKR only has two books left to go,
she almost ignored the intra-trio romance angle last time, and I'm not
sure she still has time to bring a serious romance to fruition in the
remaining books.
Possible, but I doubt it. It's already there. She hasn't spent much time on the romantic
aspect, but then, one would expect more of it in the last two books when they're 16 and
17.

In any case, she has said that we'll get an epilogue at the end where we see what happens
to all the characters. We'll know how it all goes.
gjw
2004-02-18 19:13:51 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:34:50 -0800, "Tim Behrendsen"
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
I disagree. When people get a crush on someone, they often can't stop
talking about anyone BUT that person. Simply because they are always
on their mind, and one tends to talk about what is on one's mind.
Maybe to someone who is a close friend, but I personally don't go blabbing about my secret
crushes to anyone who'll listen, particularly to someone of the opposite sex who seems to
be showing some interest in me.
People with a crush might not reveal their romantic inclinations
directly, but they can't help talking about the person. They are
always thinking of them, so naturally they talk about them - even if
it's not in romantic terms. As Krum certainly noticed.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
and the incident in which Hermione might have
deliberately sabotaged Harry's Valentines Day date with Cho, outweigh
any vague hints about her and Ron.
This is not valid, since Hermione had no other way she could have arranged the meeting.
Perhaps. Or perhaps it was just a clever way of killing two birds with
one stone. Hermione is not socially naive nor is she ignorant of the
way Cho was likely to react to that sort of setup...
Except that it was Harry that screwed it up. It wouldn't have been a big deal if Harry had
just explained things a little better.
Hermione knows Harry. She knew he would screw it up.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Hermione might have predicted that somehow Harry
would screw it up, but it was a rather overly elaborate plan.
Not that elaborate. Tell Harry to meet another girl right in the
middle of a big date, and it's pretty certain the girl will get angry.
Even Harry sensed this when Hermione told him to meet her.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
If Hermione wanted to screw
up Cho, she could have done it much simpler ways. At the very least, she could have
withheld her (good) advice to Harry.
She only gave the advice AFTER she had sabotaged his date (if that is
what she did - it's unclear, since we can't read her mind.)
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
But the reality is that Hermione hasn't paid attention (romantically) to anyone by
Krum.
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Well, except for the fact that she kissed Ron for good luck in OotP (which is much
different from Harry's kiss in GoF, which was in the context of sympathy).
Both kisses were platonic, and tell us nothing.
So then why did she only kiss Ron good luck, and not Harry?
Because the poor SOB had obviously gotten in over his head in
Quidditch, he was a nervous wreck, and he was about to go out an make
a complete fool out of himself in the Quidditch match (prompting the
Slytherin's "Weasley is Our King" song.) She felt sorry for him and
wanted to give him some confidence. Harry doesn't need that - he's
already a great Quidditch player.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
And more importantly, what is
JKR trying to convey in that scene by having Hermione kiss Ron at all? And what is she
trying to convey by Ron's reaction?
JKR is trying to show that Ron likes Hermione. Not vice versa.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
The ultimate argument against is really literary. Family is the most important thing to
Harry, and if JKR was going to set up a future for Harry and Hermione, then we would
know
Post by gjw
Post by Tim Behrendsen
a lot more about her family. I know some people don't like the "One Big Happy Weasley
Family" scenerio, but it's the only one that makes literary sense (assuming Harry
lives).
Post by gjw
Again, I disagree. Both films and literature have a long history of
having the main girl end up with the main guy. Sidekicks rarely get
the girl. The reason is simple: readers/viewers identify with the main
character in a story, so when it comes time for the girl to choose,
she (in effect) chooses the reader/viewer by choosing the main man.
The problem with this theory is that Hermione is a sidekick, not a main girl. There is no
"leading lady" so far in the story. Both Ron and Hermione equally orbit Harry as
characters.
Of course she's the main girl. Who else would be? Walk up to anyone on
the street who has read Harry Potter and ask them this simple
question: "Who is the main girl in the Harry Potter series?" If they
don't say "Hermione", they haven't read the books.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
The only reason Ron is paying attention to Hermione now (after years
of not being able to get along with her) is that his hormones are
kicking in, so he's temporarily overlooking their obvious differences.
That kind of physical thing can lead to interesting short-term
affairs, but in the long run it's a serious mismatch which would lead
to disaster.
The secret to a good relationship is having personalities that complement each other, not
being carbon copies. Ron helps Hermione loosen up and have fun, and Hermione helps Ron
take life more seriously.
The secret of a good relationship is NOT to have complete opposites
who only get together because they're sexually aroused. Before the
hormones kicked in to confuse things, Harry and Hermione have always
gotten along much better than Ron and Hermione. Once the hormones cool
down, they still have to spend a life together.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
If you want to think of a disaster relationship, consider Harry and Hermione. Hermione
would nag Harry, causing Harry to pull into himself. Hermione gets frustrated at Harry's
lack of communication. Ron is much more equipped to handle Hermione's nagging.
No, Ron is much more equipped to fight and bicker with Hermione when
she nags him. That's not communicating. Perhaps the solution (for
either couple) is for Hermione to stop nagging so much.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
And there is nothing mandating that Harry automatically inherit a
giant family. He and his future wife (whoever she may be) can create
their own family... and still have a lot of close friends in the
Weasleys.
Certainly they could, but again I go back to literary structure. If JKR wanted to
foreshadow a future life for Harry and Hermione, then she would spend more time on it. At
the very least, she would show Harry /meeting/ Hermione's parents!
Has Ron met them? JKR just doesn't talk much about Hermione's parents.
They are Muggles, and it's clear that she thinks they're dull. As far
as I can recall, the only time JKR has even let us see the parents was
in "Chamber of Secrets", and that was in order to remind us that
Hermione is Muggle-born, since the plot revolved around someone
killing (actually petrifying) Mudbloods. It also allowed Malfoy Sr. to
show his true colors by insulting them in the book shop.
Post by Tim Behrendsen
Post by gjw
Personally, though, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Harry (and
the rest of the trio) still remain unattached at the end of the
series. They are still quite young. JKR only has two books left to go,
she almost ignored the intra-trio romance angle last time, and I'm not
sure she still has time to bring a serious romance to fruition in the
remaining books.
Possible, but I doubt it. It's already there. She hasn't spent much time on the romantic
aspect, but then, one would expect more of it in the last two books when they're 16 and
17.
In any case, she has said that we'll get an epilogue at the end where we see what happens
to all the characters. We'll know how it all goes.
It sounds like the end of "American Graffiti"... or "Fast Times at
Ridgemont High". ;)

But that's actually a good point. Assuming everyone is alive, at least
we'll probably know who they pair off with, even if JKR doesn't
develop the romantic plot through the remaining two books.
stark
2004-02-18 14:38:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Post by stark
Not like I really want to restart this debate now, but I feel the need to at
least supply the evidence...
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
Couric: "Any snogging with Hermione?"
Rowling: [surprised] "Harry and Hermione! Do you think so?" -- From
That is a question, not an answer. Which makes me suspicious, as if
she's trying to avoid directly answering the reporter's question.
We have no known instances of Rowling every deceiving us with interview
answers. She has even said that she answers questions directly and
truthfully, except in cases where it might give away future plot, and then
she will simply avoid saying anything.
The point is, she did not give an answer. She answered the question
with a question. "Do /you/ think so?" If you choose to interpret that
as anything other than simple evasion, you're fooling yourself.
Actually, the question was more like "Do you /think so/?", with the stress
not on the 'you', but rather on the idea of any thinking that Harry and
Hermione were suited for each other. In this case, the text is not enough.
You'd have to see it to be able to even guess at how to take it.
Post by gjw
Post by stark
We have unfiltered access to Harry's thoughts, and they are strictly
platonic toward Hermione. I'd define 'platonic' as "non-romantic". Harry
has no romantic feelings toward Hermione, and the plot doesn't seem even
remotely set up to easily accomidate such a thing.
As I stated in the paragraph you were apparently responding to, up
until now Harry and Hermione's relationship has indeed been strictly
platonic. The key words are "up until now".
Harry didn't even think about girls until Cho, and he certainly wasn't
thinking about Hermione in any romantic sense when he was busy chasing
Cho. (I remember hearing Vivian Leigh say that she never noticed Clark
Gable romantically during the filming of "Gone With the Wind" because
she was in the middle of a romance with Laurence Olivier.) But the Cho
episode is over. Ron's relationship with Hermione was downplayed
(indeed almost ignored) in the last book. The playing field has been
cleared for the next chapter... If that's the way Rowling wants to
play it.
As I said, she can write whatever she wants, but its pretty poor writing to
include all of the rather strong references from GoF if they go nowhere.
And ignoring the references and creating a semi-conflicting result would be
truly jarring. There would need to be at least one book of setup.
Post by gjw
Post by stark
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
Q: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione
during the last half of Goblet of Fire?
A: "Yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical
boy." -- From a BarnesandNoble.com chat with JK Rowling
There is no question that something is going on in GoF. The problem is
that it is probably one-sided. Ron, who always thought of Hermione as
a platonic friend (and occasional pain in the neck) notices that she
is a girl (after her Cinderella transformation before the Yule Ball).
Ron is no doubt slightly smitten on Hermione. The problem is that it's
quite possible that Hermione may not feel the same for Ron.
There are several occasions where we see hints that its not. There are a
number of occasions where Hermione expresses what any 12 year old will
identify as jealousy whenever Fleur gives any attention to Ron, or Ron to
Fleur. And the post-Ball argument is distinctly lacking in hypotheticals,
its Ron and Hermione arguing about each other.
You are simply seeing what you want to see.
That's odd. How do you know what I want to see? Even I dont.

That was the point. I really dont care who ends up with who. I certainly
dont want romance to play a major part in these books, and a sadistic part
of me would laugh with glee if Rowling never resolved such things, and
instead left all the militant 'shippers' to wage their wars for eternity.

When I first started reading the books, I assumed it would be Harry and
Hermione out of the basic "Alpha Male" principle (Lead male character gets
the most prominently featured female). Its at the core of our social
structure. We expect the Quarterback to get the Head Cheerleader.

After reading GoF, I was forced to admit to myself that the author simply
wasn't setting that up, but there was something set up between Ron and
Hermione. Its unconventional in stories, and many people dont like
convention to be ignored.
Post by gjw
Hermione's reactions are
evidence of envy towards Fleur and her flirtatious ways, and of
general disgust that boys can be so easily manipulated by a pretty
face, more than they are of jealousy about either of the boys.
"Look after Gabrielle," she told her, and then she turned to Harry.
"You saved 'er," she said breathlessly. "Even though she was not your
'ostage."

"Yeah," said Harry, who was now heartily wishing he'd left all three
girls tied to the statue.

Fleur bent down, kissed Harry twice on each cheek (he felt his face
burn and wouldn't have been surprised if steam was coming out of his
ears again), then said to Ron, "And you too-you 'elped -"

"Yeah," said Ron, looking extremely hopeful, "yeah, a bit -"

Fleur swooped down on him too and kissed him. Hermione looked simply
furious, but just then, Ludo Bagman's magically magnified voice boomed
out beside them, making them all jump, and causing the crowd in the
stands to go very quiet.

Hermione looked furious after Ron was kissed. There is no reaction noted
after Harry's kiss. In the world of literature, proximity is used to convey
relations. Ron was kissed, and immediately Rowling notes that Hermione is
upset.

I can think of no correct interpretation of that passage other than saying
that Hermione is more upset by Ron's kiss than Harry's.

"'Arry!"

He looked around. Fleur Delacour was hurrying up the stone steps into
the castle. Beyond her, far across the grounds. Harry could see Hagrid
helping Madame Maxime to back two of the giant horses into their
harness. The Beauxbatons carriage was about to take off.

"We will see each uzzer again, I 'ope," said Fleur as she reached him,
holding out her hand. "I am 'oping to get a job 'ere, to improve my
Eenglish."

"It's very good already," said Ron in a strangled sort of voice. Fleur
smiled at him; Hermione scowled.

...and there it is again. Hermione showing displeasure right after Fleur
pays any attention to Ron. In this case, its actually in the same sentence,
with punctuation making the link between Hermione's scowl and Fleur smiling
at Ron an explicit one.
Post by gjw
If you want to start citing scenes that probably don't mean anything,
the incident in which Krum tells Harry he believes that Harry &
Hermione are lovers,
Um... how about we say: "...Harry & Hermione are daing,"
Post by gjw
and the incident in which Hermione might have
deliberately sabotaged Harry's Valentines Day date with Cho, outweigh
any vague hints about her and Ron. But the reality is that Hermione
hasn't paid attention (romantically) to anyone by Krum.
As someone else has pointed out to me, its very likely you are a male.
Those scenes can be seen as evidence, but they completely lack any emotion
on Hermione's part. They dont have the emotion she displays in GoF toward
Ron. In both cases, Hermione seems mostly indifferent, whereas her
interactions will Ron show an uncharacteristic amount of emotion.
Post by gjw
Both of the boys have spent the last five years virtually living with
Hermione - if that's not a foundation for a relationship, I don't know
what is.
So, you're admitting you dont know what the foundation for a relationship
is? </joke> I'm not trying to be insulting or condescending, but I'm now
curious of your age.

In my experience, extended periods of close contact do more to suppress
romantic feelings than they do to promote them. If two people are not at
all romantically inclined toward each other and they start spending a lot of
time together, any romantic feelings tend to be suppressed. If they were
romantically inclined to begin with, they tend to form a different dynamic
and it will allow (though not necessarily promote) for an escalation in the
romance.

In the case where the extended contact spans puberty or whenever the first
relationship experience occurs, I've only ever seen a boy and girl become
involved if they are the first people they are attracted to (that first
crush of adolescence).

When I was younger, most of my friends were girls. Its a double-edged
sword, really. I learned quite a bit about women, but none of them ever
expressed any interest in dating me. My first "crush" (gives the wrong
idea) lived a ways away, and had already dated a couple guys.
Post by gjw
Post by stark
So, yes, nothing she's said rules it out, but similarly, nothing she's said
has ruled out the possibility that Harry and Ron get together.
Now you're just being absurd...
Yes. But as others have pointed out, there is more evidence for Ron and
Harry, than for Hermione and Harry.

Sure Harry and Hermione is a possibility, but you're blind if you dont think
that Ron and Hermione has to be resolved as well.
--
737461726B3A30322F31382F3034203038353023696E636C756465203C6373746469
6F3E0A23696E636C756465203C756E697374642E683E0A6D61696E28297B666F7228
6368617220632C693D2D313B7265616428302C26632C31293B69253D333429707269
6E74662822257325303258222C2B2B693D3D33343F225C6E223A22222C63293B7D0A
Chistaya
2004-02-18 19:31:20 UTC
Permalink
"Hem, hem."

All eyes in the group turned toward Professor Umbridge.

"I have warned you before about this sort of thing,"
she said. The menacing tone of her voice was a sharp
contrast to the wide smile on her face.

"Mr. Longbottom, could you please remind everyone what
the title of this thread is?"

Neville looked up uneasily. "Um, it's 'Disappointing
Lupin Photo,' ma'am."

Professor Umbridge nodded. "And could you tell us what
people are discussing here?"

"Well," Neville stammered, "they...they are talking about
whether or not Harry and Hermione are going to start
dating."

Hermione blushed. The Slytherins on the other side of
the room started to giggle.

"Indeed," Professor Umbridge continued. "Is this
appropriate conduct for this newsgroup?"

"No, Professor."

"Now, could anyone tell me when it IS appropriate to
discuss such a subject?"

Hermione's hand shot up in the air. Professor Umbridge
glared at her and turned away.

"Miss Parkinson, could you tell the class?"

Pansy stood up and primly adjusted her robes before
continuing. "According to Educational Decree Number 58,
ships and slash, that is, relationships between
characters, can only be discussed in the following places:
threads speculating about the plotlines in Books 6 and 7,
criticisms of fanfics, and...and...um, odd-numbered posts
in flame wars between Dragon Friend and Fatwa Sam
regarding the treatment of newbies."

"Yes, thank you, Miss Parkinson. Ten points to Slytherin.
Now if you will all open your textbooks and begin reading
Chapter 12."

Harry held his hand up. Professor Umbridge obviously
planned to ignore him so he cleared his throat loudly.

"A-hem, a-hem."

"Yes, Mr. Potter?"

"I have a question related to the Disappointing Lupin
Photo."

"Make it quick," she snarled at him impatiently.

"Well, you know the series of promotional photos that
it came from? I guess I was just wondering why they
made my hair look so stupid. I know it's supposed to
look messy, but that hair doesn't look naturally messy,
you know, like someone with a lot of cowlicks. It looks
like they tied me to a chair and forced me to listen to
Cher's Greatest Hits while the entire cast of 'Queer
Eye For The Straight Guy' danced around for three hours
debating whether the tuft of hair over my left ear
should point sideways or backward. I'm thinking that
maybe the bowl haircut that I had in the first movie
wasn't so bad now."

"Your haircuts are really not your problem, Mr. Potter."
Professor Umbridge gave him a forced, coy smile.
"Nevertheless, you may be assured that when Minister of
Magic, Cornelius Fudge, selected Mr. Cuaron to direct the
third movie, he had everyone's best interests at heart.
Furthermore, you should rest easily knowing that any
cinematic deviations from the original books would have
required the express consent of Lord Voldemort, erm, I
mean J.K. Rowling."

Hermione held her hand up. "Well then, how do you explain
those...those horrible GOGGLES?"

Before Professor Umbridge could answer, Draco Malfoy
interrupted.

"Well, I, for one, happen to like the goggles. I mean,
I'm always looking for something to make fun of Potter
for, and frankly, I think the goggles are a smashing
idea!"

Harry hid his face in his hands. Ron leaned over to him.
"C'mon, mate, the goggles aren't so bad. They make you
look a bit like a World War I flying ace. You know,
like the Red Baron...or Snoopy! Hey, d'you think you
could charm your broom to look like a doghouse?"

Harry groaned. Neville reached across the desk and tapped
Harry on the back. "Um, Harry, as long as you've already
made her mad, could you ask her if Professor Lupin is
going to wipe that dirt off his upper lip before the movie
comes out?"

Harry turned around and glowered at him. "Why don't YOU
ask her?"

Suddenly Professor Umbridge was standing next to them.
"Ask me what?"

"Um, uh," Neville struggled for a moment, then blurted
out, "I wanted to know if we were going to be stuck with
Professor Lupin looking like a pervy dweeb for the whole
movie?"

She steeled her eyes on him. "Once again, Mr. Longbottom,
you have demonstrated how shallow your understanding really
is. For your information, when a Pervy Dweeb is combined
with a werewolf, the resulting creature always resembles
Michael Jackson in the 'Thriller' video. Professor Lupin, on
the other hand, looks like a Creepy Doofus, which is another
type of creature altogether. Doesn't that idiotic, half-breed
oaf teach you children anything in Care of Magical Creatures
class?"

She turned on her heel and strode to the front of the room
where she stared mercilessly at the class. Then she
composed herself and smiled sweetly at them.

"Please continue with what you were doing before we went
off on this unpleasant tangent...."



***@aol.com
Hannigaholic BA (Hons)
2004-02-18 19:44:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chistaya
"Hem, hem."
All eyes in the group turned toward Professor Umbridge.
"I have warned you before about this sort of thing,"
she said. The menacing tone of her voice was a sharp
contrast to the wide smile on her face.
"Mr. Longbottom, could you please remind everyone what
the title of this thread is?"
Neville looked up uneasily. "Um, it's 'Disappointing
Lupin Photo,' ma'am."
Professor Umbridge nodded. "And could you tell us what
people are discussing here?"
"Well," Neville stammered, "they...they are talking about
whether or not Harry and Hermione are going to start
dating."
Hermione blushed. The Slytherins on the other side of
the room started to giggle.
"Indeed," Professor Umbridge continued. "Is this
appropriate conduct for this newsgroup?"
"No, Professor."
"Now, could anyone tell me when it IS appropriate to
discuss such a subject?"
Hermione's hand shot up in the air. Professor Umbridge
glared at her and turned away.
"Miss Parkinson, could you tell the class?"
Pansy stood up and primly adjusted her robes before
continuing. "According to Educational Decree Number 58,
ships and slash, that is, relationships between
threads speculating about the plotlines in Books 6 and 7,
criticisms of fanfics, and...and...um, odd-numbered posts
in flame wars between Dragon Friend and Fatwa Sam
regarding the treatment of newbies."
"Yes, thank you, Miss Parkinson. Ten points to Slytherin.
Now if you will all open your textbooks and begin reading
Chapter 12."
Harry held his hand up. Professor Umbridge obviously
planned to ignore him so he cleared his throat loudly.
"A-hem, a-hem."
"Yes, Mr. Potter?"
"I have a question related to the Disappointing Lupin
Photo."
"Make it quick," she snarled at him impatiently.
"Well, you know the series of promotional photos that
it came from? I guess I was just wondering why they
made my hair look so stupid. I know it's supposed to
look messy, but that hair doesn't look naturally messy,
you know, like someone with a lot of cowlicks. It looks
like they tied me to a chair and forced me to listen to
Cher's Greatest Hits while the entire cast of 'Queer
Eye For The Straight Guy' danced around for three hours
debating whether the tuft of hair over my left ear
should point sideways or backward. I'm thinking that
maybe the bowl haircut that I had in the first movie
wasn't so bad now."
"Your haircuts are really not your problem, Mr. Potter."
Professor Umbridge gave him a forced, coy smile.
"Nevertheless, you may be assured that when Minister of
Magic, Cornelius Fudge, selected Mr. Cuaron to direct the
third movie, he had everyone's best interests at heart.
Furthermore, you should rest easily knowing that any
cinematic deviations from the original books would have
required the express consent of Lord Voldemort, erm, I
mean J.K. Rowling."
Hermione held her hand up. "Well then, how do you explain
those...those horrible GOGGLES?"
Before Professor Umbridge could answer, Draco Malfoy
interrupted.
"Well, I, for one, happen to like the goggles. I mean,
I'm always looking for something to make fun of Potter
for, and frankly, I think the goggles are a smashing
idea!"
Harry hid his face in his hands. Ron leaned over to him.
"C'mon, mate, the goggles aren't so bad. They make you
look a bit like a World War I flying ace. You know,
like the Red Baron...or Snoopy! Hey, d'you think you
could charm your broom to look like a doghouse?"
Harry groaned. Neville reached across the desk and tapped
Harry on the back. "Um, Harry, as long as you've already
made her mad, could you ask her if Professor Lupin is
going to wipe that dirt off his upper lip before the movie
comes out?"
Harry turned around and glowered at him. "Why don't YOU
ask her?"
Suddenly Professor Umbridge was standing next to them.
"Ask me what?"
"Um, uh," Neville struggled for a moment, then blurted
out, "I wanted to know if we were going to be stuck with
Professor Lupin looking like a pervy dweeb for the whole
movie?"
She steeled her eyes on him. "Once again, Mr. Longbottom,
you have demonstrated how shallow your understanding really
is. For your information, when a Pervy Dweeb is combined
with a werewolf, the resulting creature always resembles
Michael Jackson in the 'Thriller' video. Professor Lupin, on
the other hand, looks like a Creepy Doofus, which is another
type of creature altogether. Doesn't that idiotic, half-breed
oaf teach you children anything in Care of Magical Creatures
class?"
She turned on her heel and strode to the front of the room
where she stared mercilessly at the class. Then she
composed herself and smiled sweetly at them.
"Please continue with what you were doing before we went
off on this unpleasant tangent...."
Yeah, but what about Harry and Hermione?

;-)
unknown
2004-02-20 22:14:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chistaya
"Hem, hem."
All eyes in the group turned toward Professor Umbridge.
"I have warned you before about this sort of thing,"
she said. The menacing tone of her voice was a sharp
contrast to the wide smile on her face.
"Mr. Longbottom, could you please remind everyone what
the title of this thread is?"
Neville looked up uneasily. "Um, it's 'Disappointing
Lupin Photo,' ma'am."
Professor Umbridge nodded. "And could you tell us what
people are discussing here?"
"Well," Neville stammered, "they...they are talking about
whether or not Harry and Hermione are going to start
dating."
Hermione blushed. The Slytherins on the other side of
the room started to giggle.
"Indeed," Professor Umbridge continued. "Is this
appropriate conduct for this newsgroup?"
"No, Professor."
"Now, could anyone tell me when it IS appropriate to
discuss such a subject?"
Hermione's hand shot up in the air. Professor Umbridge
glared at her and turned away.
"Miss Parkinson, could you tell the class?"
Pansy stood up and primly adjusted her robes before
continuing. "According to Educational Decree Number 58,
ships and slash, that is, relationships between
threads speculating about the plotlines in Books 6 and 7,
criticisms of fanfics, and...and...um, odd-numbered posts
in flame wars between Dragon Friend and Fatwa Sam
regarding the treatment of newbies."
"Yes, thank you, Miss Parkinson. Ten points to Slytherin.
Now if you will all open your textbooks and begin reading
Chapter 12."
Harry held his hand up. Professor Umbridge obviously
planned to ignore him so he cleared his throat loudly.
"A-hem, a-hem."
"Yes, Mr. Potter?"
"I have a question related to the Disappointing Lupin
Photo."
"Make it quick," she snarled at him impatiently.
"Well, you know the series of promotional photos that
it came from? I guess I was just wondering why they
made my hair look so stupid. I know it's supposed to
look messy, but that hair doesn't look naturally messy,
you know, like someone with a lot of cowlicks. It looks
like they tied me to a chair and forced me to listen to
Cher's Greatest Hits while the entire cast of 'Queer
Eye For The Straight Guy' danced around for three hours
debating whether the tuft of hair over my left ear
should point sideways or backward. I'm thinking that
maybe the bowl haircut that I had in the first movie
wasn't so bad now."
"Your haircuts are really not your problem, Mr. Potter."
Professor Umbridge gave him a forced, coy smile.
"Nevertheless, you may be assured that when Minister of
Magic, Cornelius Fudge, selected Mr. Cuaron to direct the
third movie, he had everyone's best interests at heart.
Furthermore, you should rest easily knowing that any
cinematic deviations from the original books would have
required the express consent of Lord Voldemort, erm, I
mean J.K. Rowling."
Hermione held her hand up. "Well then, how do you explain
those...those horrible GOGGLES?"
Before Professor Umbridge could answer, Draco Malfoy
interrupted.
"Well, I, for one, happen to like the goggles. I mean,
I'm always looking for something to make fun of Potter
for, and frankly, I think the goggles are a smashing
idea!"
Harry hid his face in his hands. Ron leaned over to him.
"C'mon, mate, the goggles aren't so bad. They make you
look a bit like a World War I flying ace. You know,
like the Red Baron...or Snoopy! Hey, d'you think you
could charm your broom to look like a doghouse?"
Harry groaned. Neville reached across the desk and tapped
Harry on the back. "Um, Harry, as long as you've already
made her mad, could you ask her if Professor Lupin is
going to wipe that dirt off his upper lip before the movie
comes out?"
Harry turned around and glowered at him. "Why don't YOU
ask her?"
Suddenly Professor Umbridge was standing next to them.
"Ask me what?"
"Um, uh," Neville struggled for a moment, then blurted
out, "I wanted to know if we were going to be stuck with
Professor Lupin looking like a pervy dweeb for the whole
movie?"
She steeled her eyes on him. "Once again, Mr. Longbottom,
you have demonstrated how shallow your understanding really
is. For your information, when a Pervy Dweeb is combined
with a werewolf, the resulting creature always resembles
Michael Jackson in the 'Thriller' video. Professor Lupin, on
the other hand, looks like a Creepy Doofus, which is another
type of creature altogether. Doesn't that idiotic, half-breed
oaf teach you children anything in Care of Magical Creatures
class?"
She turned on her heel and strode to the front of the room
where she stared mercilessly at the class. Then she
composed herself and smiled sweetly at them.
"Please continue with what you were doing before we went
off on this unpleasant tangent...."
Applause from the audience.

bravo
bravo
bravo

(reposted in its entirety...no snipping of art children while we are
in the museum)

BigRed

gjw
2004-02-18 19:44:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by stark
As I said, she can write whatever she wants, but its pretty poor writing to
include all of the rather strong references from GoF if they go nowhere.
And ignoring the references and creating a semi-conflicting result would be
truly jarring. There would need to be at least one book of setup.
But the references in GoF don't go nowhere. They point to the fact
that Ron likes Hermione. That could have evolved one of two ways.
Either Hermione could start liking Ron back, or she could start liking
someone else, setting up a rivalry/jealousy scenario. (Or, come to
think of it, Hermione could just ignore him, and his frustrated
interest in her could be played for laughs - although that would be a
bit cruel.)

Personally, I'm now leaning towards the idea that JKR won't get
Hermione together with either of the boys in the next two books. I
think she missed her chance to develop it in OotP, where the only
romance seen was Harry losing Cho.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
Post by stark
Post by gjw
Post by Allyson Robinson
Q: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione
during the last half of Goblet of Fire?
A: "Yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical
boy." -- From a BarnesandNoble.com chat with JK Rowling
There is no question that something is going on in GoF. The problem is
that it is probably one-sided. Ron, who always thought of Hermione as
a platonic friend (and occasional pain in the neck) notices that she
is a girl (after her Cinderella transformation before the Yule Ball).
Ron is no doubt slightly smitten on Hermione. The problem is that it's
quite possible that Hermione may not feel the same for Ron.
That was the point. I really dont care who ends up with who. I certainly
dont want romance to play a major part in these books, and a sadistic part
of me would laugh with glee if Rowling never resolved such things, and
instead left all the militant 'shippers' to wage their wars for eternity.
Actually, I don't care either. I think I made the assumption from the
start that it would be Harry/Hermione, simply because the main girl
usually ends up with the leading man in these things. And Ron has been
played as comic relief on occasion. So I would be surprised if she
ended up with Ron. But I really don't care who ends up with whom, as
long as they're happy. As I've said, I suspect JKR isn't going to
pursue that thread as much as many readers expect.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
Hermione's reactions are
evidence of envy towards Fleur and her flirtatious ways, and of
general disgust that boys can be so easily manipulated by a pretty
face, more than they are of jealousy about either of the boys.
"Look after Gabrielle," she told her, and then she turned to Harry.
"You saved 'er," she said breathlessly. "Even though she was not your
'ostage."
"Yeah," said Harry, who was now heartily wishing he'd left all three
girls tied to the statue.
Fleur bent down, kissed Harry twice on each cheek (he felt his face
burn and wouldn't have been surprised if steam was coming out of his
ears again), then said to Ron, "And you too-you 'elped -"
"Yeah," said Ron, looking extremely hopeful, "yeah, a bit -"
Fleur swooped down on him too and kissed him. Hermione looked simply
furious, but just then, Ludo Bagman's magically magnified voice boomed
out beside them, making them all jump, and causing the crowd in the
stands to go very quiet.
Hermione looked furious after Ron was kissed. There is no reaction noted
after Harry's kiss. In the world of literature, proximity is used to convey
relations. Ron was kissed, and immediately Rowling notes that Hermione is
upset.
Actually, Hermione's fury takes place after Fleur has kissed both of
the boys. I wouldn't expect Rowling to say she looked furious twice.
To me, the reaction is simply one of territory. These are Hermione's
friends (and perhaps potential lovers) and here comes this half-Veela
swooping in on her turf and making the boys act like blithering
idiots. Hermione is envious of (or perhaps disgusted with) Fleur's
ability to charm the boys so easily, and she's jealous that Fleur
seems capable of taking either of them at will. That would make most
people furious.
Post by stark
"We will see each uzzer again, I 'ope," said Fleur as she reached him,
holding out her hand. "I am 'oping to get a job 'ere, to improve my
Eenglish."
"It's very good already," said Ron in a strangled sort of voice. Fleur
smiled at him; Hermione scowled.
...and there it is again. Hermione showing displeasure right after Fleur
pays any attention to Ron.
Same reason as before.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
If you want to start citing scenes that probably don't mean anything,
the incident in which Krum tells Harry he believes that Harry &
Hermione are lovers,
Um... how about we say: "...Harry & Hermione are daing,"
Actually, I thought I picked up something a bit more explicit in
Krum's questioning. I thought it a bit odd (given the age of the
kids), but Krum is older himself, so he may have read something more
physical into the supposed relationship. Here's the text:

<quote>

"I vant to know," he said, glowering, "vot there is between you and
Hermy-own-ninny."

Harry, who from Krum's secretive manner had expected something much
more serious than this, stared up at Krum in amazement.

"Nothing," he said. But Krum glowered at him, and Harry, somehow
struck anew by how tall Krum was, elaborated. "We're friends. She's
not my girlfriend and she never has been. It's just that Skeeter woman
making things up."

"Hermy-own-ninny talks about you very often," said Krum, looking
suspiciously at Harry.

"Yeah," said Harry, "because were friends."

He couldn't quite believe he was having this conversation with Viktor
Krum, the famous International Quidditch player. It was as though the
eighteen-year-old Krum thought he. Harry, was an equal - a real rival
-"

You haff never . . . you haff not..."

"No," said Harry very firmly.

<end of quote>


Maybe it's just me, but I took that "You haff never . . . you haff
not..." to be asking if there was anything physical between them.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
and the incident in which Hermione might have
deliberately sabotaged Harry's Valentines Day date with Cho, outweigh
any vague hints about her and Ron. But the reality is that Hermione
hasn't paid attention (romantically) to anyone by Krum.
As someone else has pointed out to me, its very likely you are a male.
Horrors! Pardon my gender. ;)
Post by stark
Those scenes can be seen as evidence, but they completely lack any emotion
on Hermione's part. They dont have the emotion she displays in GoF toward
Ron. In both cases, Hermione seems mostly indifferent, whereas her
interactions will Ron show an uncharacteristic amount of emotion.
The main emotion I see her displaying towards Ron is that of anger and
frustration, because Ron is such a klutz most of the time. They
bickered like cats & dogs long before their hormones kicked in - they
just don't get along very well. Actually, (until he started getting a
crush on her) I suspect that the only reason Ron hung out with
Hermione at all is because of Harry. Harry liked both Ron and Hermione
as friends, so Ron went along with it.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
Both of the boys have spent the last five years virtually living with
Hermione - if that's not a foundation for a relationship, I don't know
what is.
So, you're admitting you dont know what the foundation for a relationship
is? </joke> I'm not trying to be insulting or condescending, but I'm now
curious of your age.
Much older than you. Trust me.
Post by stark
Post by gjw
Post by stark
So, yes, nothing she's said rules it out, but similarly, nothing she's said
has ruled out the possibility that Harry and Ron get together.
Now you're just being absurd...
Yes. But as others have pointed out, there is more evidence for Ron and
Harry, than for Hermione and Harry.
Or for Ron and Hermione, for that matter. It's still absurd.
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-18 19:55:08 UTC
Permalink
I think she missed her chance to develop it in OotP, where the only
romance seen was Harry losing Cho.
Harry lost Cho? I thought he decided he wasn't all that interested in her.
How can you "lose" something you don't want?

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"DENETHOR INSANITY METER = YOUR AVERAGE GARY OLDMAN CHARACTER"
-From Evadne's "LotR: Return of the King: Breadbox Edition", on
fanfiction.net.
gjw
2004-02-19 03:22:42 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:55:08 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
I think she missed her chance to develop it in OotP, where the only
romance seen was Harry losing Cho.
Harry lost Cho? I thought he decided he wasn't all that interested in her.
How can you "lose" something you don't want?
As I recall, he wanted her quite a lot at the start of the book. Then
he told her about Hermione on the Valentine's Day date and Cho stopped
talking to him. Then she started talking to him again later. Then
they got into a fight over Cho's friend tattling on their DA activity
and over Hermione's jinx, and Cho stopped talking to him again. The
last time we see her, I believe, she walks by him without looking at
him, and we later hear she is dating someone else. Of course, by
then, Harry has something far more serious to think about, and he
doesn't really care...

The point I was making in the post, though, was that JKR seemed to
have abandoned the Ron/Hermione/Harry romance angle that she seemed to
be building up in GoF. I expected it to really take off in OotP, but
instead it just seemed to peter out, while she focused on Harry's
unsuccessful first steps towards romance.

Hmm... So far, the kid's first attempts haven't been going well. Ron
botched his feeble efforts with Hermione. Harry has struck out with
Cho. I wonder if Hermione will be the next one to botch one?
Allyson Robinson
2004-02-19 04:25:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:55:08 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
I think she missed her chance to develop it in OotP, where the only
romance seen was Harry losing Cho.
Harry lost Cho? I thought he decided he wasn't all that interested in her.
How can you "lose" something you don't want?
<snip Cho synopsis>
Post by gjw
The point I was making in the post, though, was that JKR seemed to
have abandoned the Ron/Hermione/Harry romance angle that she seemed to
be building up in GoF. I expected it to really take off in OotP, but
instead it just seemed to peter out, while she focused on Harry's
unsuccessful first steps towards romance.
I think we all expected something more on the Ron/Hermione angle in
OotP. However, relatively, we didn't see much of Ron or Hermione at all
this book. Who knows what was going on, on the sidelines. ;-)

<snip to end>


--------------------

Allyson Robinson
lukeandallyson.com
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-19 04:27:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
I think she missed her chance to develop it in OotP, where the
only romance seen was Harry losing Cho.
Harry lost Cho? I thought he decided he wasn't all that
interested in her. How can you "lose" something you don't want?
As I recall, he wanted her quite a lot at the start of the book.
Well, yes. But by the end, he didn't.
Post by gjw
Then he told her about Hermione on the Valentine's Day date and
Cho stopped talking to him. Then she started talking to him again
later. Then they got into a fight over Cho's friend tattling on
their DA activity and over Hermione's jinx, and Cho stopped talking
to him again.
It seems like by then, he wasn't all that thrilled with her.
Post by gjw
The last time we see her, I believe, she walks by him without
looking at him, and we later hear she is dating someone else.
Of course, by then, Harry has something far more serious to
think about, and he doesn't really care...
Exactly. Though it seems to be he's lost interest in her before that.
Post by gjw
The point I was making in the post, though, was that JKR seemed to
have abandoned the Ron/Hermione/Harry romance angle that she
seemed to be building up in GoF.
Yes, and I ignored that part of the post since I do NOT want to get into
the "Who will Hermione/Ron/Harry end up with?" thing.
Post by gjw
Hmm... So far, the kid's first attempts haven't been going well.
Which is often how it happens in real life. I doubt many people marry and
spend their lives with their "first love".

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
Right now you are reading my .sig quote.
Meghan Noecker
2004-02-19 06:06:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
As I recall, he wanted her quite a lot at the start of the book. Then
he told her about Hermione on the Valentine's Day date and Cho stopped
talking to him. Then she started talking to him again later. Then
they got into a fight over Cho's friend tattling on their DA activity
and over Hermione's jinx, and Cho stopped talking to him again. The
last time we see her, I believe, she walks by him without looking at
him, and we later hear she is dating someone else. Of course, by
then, Harry has something far more serious to think about, and he
doesn't really care...
I had a totally different impression of the Harry/Cho thing. I thought
that Cho just wanted to talk about Cedric, and she really was rather
shallow. After that, Harry wasn't interested.

Maybe I need to go back and reread it. Not that I need an excuse.


Meghan & the Zoo Crew
Equine and Pet Photography
http://www.zoocrewphoto.com
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-19 06:34:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Meghan Noecker
Post by gjw
As I recall, he wanted her quite a lot at the start of the book.
Then he told her about Hermione on the Valentine's Day date and
Cho stopped talking to him. Then she started talking to him again
later. Then they got into a fight over Cho's friend tattling on
their DA activity and over Hermione's jinx, and Cho stopped
talking to him again. The last time we see her, I believe, she
walks by him without looking at him, and we later hear she is
dating someone else. Of course, by then, Harry has something far
more serious to think about, and he doesn't really care...
I had a totally different impression of the Harry/Cho thing. I
thought that Cho just wanted to talk about Cedric, and she really
was rather shallow. After that, Harry wasn't interested.
Maybe I need to go back and reread it.
That's the impression I got, too. Harry lost interest in her before he
ever heard about her finding someone else. And it wasn't because he had
"something far more serious to think about".

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"DENETHOR INSANITY METER = YOUR AVERAGE GARY OLDMAN CHARACTER"
-From Evadne's "LotR: Return of the King: Breadbox Edition", on
fanfiction.net.
gjw
2004-02-19 20:57:15 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:34:54 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Meghan Noecker
Post by gjw
As I recall, he wanted her quite a lot at the start of the book.
Then he told her about Hermione on the Valentine's Day date and
Cho stopped talking to him. Then she started talking to him again
later. Then they got into a fight over Cho's friend tattling on
their DA activity and over Hermione's jinx, and Cho stopped
talking to him again. The last time we see her, I believe, she
walks by him without looking at him, and we later hear she is
dating someone else. Of course, by then, Harry has something far
more serious to think about, and he doesn't really care...
I had a totally different impression of the Harry/Cho thing. I
thought that Cho just wanted to talk about Cedric, and she really
was rather shallow. After that, Harry wasn't interested.
Maybe I need to go back and reread it.
That's the impression I got, too. Harry lost interest in her before he
ever heard about her finding someone else. And it wasn't because he had
"something far more serious to think about".
The semi-final break comes during the argument (between Harry and Cho)
over the fact that Cho's friend has betrayed his DA group. Harry is
naturally angry. Cho tries to defend her friend, and says it was
terrible that she ended up jinxed. Harry says it was OK with him that
Hermione jinxed her. Cho gets mad at the mention of Hermione again (an
echo of the initial Valentine's Day fiasco), and that's about that.
Before Harry has a chance to think much more about it, he is sucked
into the final Ministry conflict, you-know-who is killed, and Harry is
in a black depression from then on, thinking about nothing but death
and grief. When he learns Cho has taken up with someone else, he could
care less.
Kish
2004-02-19 21:19:54 UTC
Permalink
gjw wrote:
Spoilers for OotP.

20

19

18

17

16

15

14

13

12

11

10

9

8

7

6

5

4

3

2

1
Post by gjw
The semi-final break comes during the argument (between Harry and Cho)
over the fact that Cho's friend has betrayed his DA group. Harry is
naturally angry. Cho tries to defend her friend, and says it was
terrible that she ended up jinxed.
More than that, says that it was terrible of Hermione to jinx the
parchment without warning them.
Post by gjw
Harry says it was OK with him that
Hermione jinxed her.
More than that, says it was a brilliant idea.
Post by gjw
Cho gets mad at the mention of Hermione again
Harry doesn't actually use Hermione's name during the meeting--only Cho
does. She gets mad at Harry (as she sees it) siding with Hermione, but
she's the one who brings Hermione up.
Post by gjw
(an
echo of the initial Valentine's Day fiasco), and that's about that.
Before Harry has a chance to think much more about it, he is sucked
into the final Ministry conflict, you-know-who is killed, and Harry is
in a black depression from then on, thinking about nothing but death
and grief. When he learns Cho has taken up with someone else, he could
care less.
Well before you-know-who is killed, Harry realizes that his primary
feeling about Cho now amounts to not being able to deal with any more
fights with her.
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-19 23:48:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
(an echo of the initial Valentine's Day fiasco), and that's about that.
Before Harry has a chance to think much more about it, he is sucked
into the final Ministry conflict, you-know-who is killed, and
Harry is in a black depression from then on, thinking about
nothing but death and grief. When he learns Cho has taken up with
someone else, he could care less.
Well before you-know-who is killed,
Wait, we have spoiler space and we're saying "you know who"? Why bother
with the space?
Post by Kish
Harry realizes that his primary feeling about Cho now amounts to
not being able to deal with any more fights with her.
Exactly. That's my main point. Harry doesn't "lose" her, he realizes,
before the MOM battle and Sirius' death, that he's not that interested in
her. She's either crying, asking him about Cedric, or fighting with him.

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
Right now you are reading my .sig quote.
Miranda
2004-02-20 00:00:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
Well before you-know-who is killed,
Wait, we have spoiler space and we're saying "you know who"? Why
bother with the space?
Yeah, actually, the phrase you-know-who is misleading here... :)
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-20 01:43:57 UTC
Permalink
I was gonna get rid of the space, but since this is a comment ABOUT the
space, I'm leaving it in.
Post by Miranda
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
Well before you-know-who is killed,
Wait, we have spoiler space and we're saying "you know who"? Why
bother with the space?
Yeah, actually, the phrase you-know-who is misleading here... :)
No kidding. ^_^
Actually, I thought of that as I was typing it in my reply, but didn't
comment on it.

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"I'm made of felt. <removes nose> And by node comes off..."
-Puppet-Angel, _Angel_.
Kish
2004-02-20 00:32:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
(an echo of the initial Valentine's Day fiasco), and that's about that.
Before Harry has a chance to think much more about it, he is sucked
into the final Ministry conflict, you-know-who is killed, and
Harry is in a black depression from then on, thinking about
nothing but death and grief. When he learns Cho has taken up with
someone else, he could care less.
Well before you-know-who is killed,
Wait, we have spoiler space and we're saying "you know who"? Why bother
with the space?
Because the post you're replying to also talked about Umbridge catching
the D.A....I should have just said "Sirius Black" instead of
"you-know-who," meh.
Bernie Dwyer
2004-02-20 01:03:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
<snip>
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Exactly. That's my main point. Harry doesn't "lose" her, he realizes,
before the MOM battle and Sirius' death, that he's not that interested in
her. She's either crying, asking him about Cedric, or fighting with him.
Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
Right now you are reading my .sig quote.
You haven't forgotten "The Kiss", have you? When added to crying,
Cedric, and fighting, it's all very confusing, and just about guaranteed
to turn him off her.

Overall, not a good first experience with romance for our Harry :-(
--
Bernie Dwyer - there are no "z" in my email address
"The compliments pass when the quality meet" - The Pogues
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-20 01:54:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bernie Dwyer
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
<snip>
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Exactly. That's my main point. Harry doesn't "lose" her, he
realizes, before the MOM battle and Sirius' death, that he's not
that interested in her. She's either crying, asking him about
Cedric, or fighting with him.
You haven't forgotten "The Kiss", have you?
Nope. I almost looked it up, in fact; it seems even then he was starting
to have doubts.
I love the way he describes it: "She just sort of came at me..."
Reminded me of _South Park_: "They're comin' right at us!" <BLAM!>
Good thing Harry's first instinct wasn't to shoot her. Though, actually,
that WOULD have been entertaining... ^_^
Post by Bernie Dwyer
When added to crying, Cedric, and fighting, it's all very confusing,
and just about guaranteed to turn him off her.
Yeah. <sigh>
Post by Bernie Dwyer
Overall, not a good first experience with romance for our Harry :-(
No... Poor guy.
)-8~ <- that's his scar...

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"I'm glad you're with me, Samwise Gamgee, here at the end of all things."
-Frodo Baggins, _LotR: Return of the King_.
Hannigaholic
2004-02-20 19:18:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Bernie Dwyer
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
<snip>
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Exactly. That's my main point. Harry doesn't "lose" her, he
realizes, before the MOM battle and Sirius' death, that he's not
that interested in her. She's either crying, asking him about
Cedric, or fighting with him.
You haven't forgotten "The Kiss", have you?
Nope. I almost looked it up, in fact; it seems even then he was
starting to have doubts.
I love the way he describes it: "She just sort of came at me..."
Reminded me of _South Park_: "They're comin' right at us!" <BLAM!>
Good thing Harry's first instinct wasn't to shoot her. Though,
actually, that WOULD have been entertaining... ^_^
Post by Bernie Dwyer
When added to crying, Cedric, and fighting, it's all very confusing,
and just about guaranteed to turn him off her.
Yeah. <sigh>
Post by Bernie Dwyer
Overall, not a good first experience with romance for our Harry :-(
No... Poor guy.
)-8~ <- that's his scar...
Catherine Johnson.
Thin out their numbers
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-20 19:51:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hannigaholic
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Bernie Dwyer
You haven't forgotten "The Kiss", have you?
Nope. I almost looked it up, in fact; it seems even then he was
starting to have doubts.
I love the way he describes it: "She just sort of came at me..."
Reminded me of _South Park_: "They're comin' right at us!"
<BLAM!> Good thing Harry's first instinct wasn't to shoot her.
Though, actually, that WOULD have been entertaining... ^_^
Thin out their numbers
Trim what you're not replying to, please. There's a lot of stuff before
and after that you actually addressed.

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"His one true superpower: He's crazy."
-CN's Web Site, about Robin from _Teen Titans_.
gjw
2004-02-20 05:58:09 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:03:41 +1000, Bernie Dwyer
Post by Bernie Dwyer
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
<snip>
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Exactly. That's my main point. Harry doesn't "lose" her, he realizes,
before the MOM battle and Sirius' death, that he's not that interested in
her. She's either crying, asking him about Cedric, or fighting with him.
Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
Right now you are reading my .sig quote.
You haven't forgotten "The Kiss", have you? When added to crying,
Cedric, and fighting, it's all very confusing, and just about guaranteed
to turn him off her.
Overall, not a good first experience with romance for our Harry :-(
Another good reason he should stick with someone he's comfortable with
already... (Sorry, couldn't resist. ;)
gjw
2004-02-20 06:01:53 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 16:48:49 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by Kish
Spoilers for OotP.
20
19
18
17
16
15
14
13
12
11
10
9
8
7
6
5
4
3
2
1
(an echo of the initial Valentine's Day fiasco), and that's about that.
Before Harry has a chance to think much more about it, he is sucked
into the final Ministry conflict, you-know-who is killed, and
Harry is in a black depression from then on, thinking about
nothing but death and grief. When he learns Cho has taken up with
someone else, he could care less.
Well before you-know-who is killed,
Wait, we have spoiler space and we're saying "you know who"? Why bother
with the space?
We were originally discussing Lupin in PoA in this thread, so I
assumed the spoiler space was warning about that book and I didn't
want to give away the big secret in OotP to someone who had read PoA
but not OotP . I didn't notice that someone had already added a
spoiler mention of OotP at the top. That's what I get for trying to
read 100 messages in ten minutes. ;)
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-17 02:35:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by gjw
Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide3.j
pg
Post by gjw
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
OMG! They're sitting there talking! IT MUST BE LURVE!!!
Please, a better "evidence" picture has been around since almost the
http://www.the-leaky-cauldron.org/images/2003/08/PoAHiResHermioneHarry.jpg
That just looks to me like he's trying to shield her.
Hence my quote marks around the word "evidence".
Post by gjw
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
And besides, hasn't JKR herself said it's not gonna happen?
No she hasn't. Cite the source please, if you can find it.
I can't, which is why I put it in the form of a question.

Catherine Johnson.
--
fenm at cox dot net
"I mean, how can you feel apprehensive about going to New Zealand? They
have penguins there, for Christ's sake."
-Brad Dourif, about filming _Lord of the Rings_.
gjw
2004-02-17 07:41:08 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:35:41 -0700, "Fish Eye no Miko"
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
Post by gjw
Post by Fish Eye no Miko
And besides, hasn't JKR herself said it's not gonna happen?
No she hasn't. Cite the source please, if you can find it.
I can't, which is why I put it in the form of a question.
Sorry, I didn't notice the question mark.
yak
2004-02-16 18:58:18 UTC
Permalink
In article <***@news.west.earthlink.net>, ***@example.com
says...
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Minus the moustache, yea. David Thewlis was always my first choice when
I did the "who should play this role" thing in my head.
Post by gjw
Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide3.jpg
Ugh... I can't think of when this would be. Harry and Hermione aren't
together alone in Hogsmeade at all in this book. In fact, Ron and Harry
aren't speaking to her at all for a good portion of it... Unless it's at
the very end when Ron might still be in the hospital wing.

But looking at it closely, it doesn't look like a real place or a real
picture. They aren't really lined up right as to be looking at each
other, and it seems like Harry is sitting in a window overlooking the
shrieking shack, and it's all by itself on the edge of town.

All I can say is that Cuaron had better not be applying his Y Tu Mama
treatment to this thing. If he did no wonder they chose someone else for
GoF.
Post by gjw
And finally, a portrait of Harry with messy hair, as the books
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide5.jpg
Yea, his blow-dried hair in the COS movie was not good at all, this is
much better.
Post by gjw
Now if only they would get his eyes the right color... In a world of
CGI magic (not to mention contact lenses), how hard could it be to
make his eyes green??
Well, they are green in the middle, heh.
http://twwo.haisoft.net/pic/displayimage.php?album=toprated&cat=0&pos=0
gjw
2004-02-17 02:24:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by yak
says...
Post by gjw
Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide3.jpg
Ugh... I can't think of when this would be. Harry and Hermione aren't
together alone in Hogsmeade at all in this book. In fact, Ron and Harry
aren't speaking to her at all for a good portion of it... Unless it's at
the very end when Ron might still be in the hospital wing.
But looking at it closely, it doesn't look like a real place or a real
picture. They aren't really lined up right as to be looking at each
other, and it seems like Harry is sitting in a window overlooking the
shrieking shack, and it's all by itself on the edge of town.
All I can say is that Cuaron had better not be applying his Y Tu Mama
treatment to this thing. If he did no wonder they chose someone else for
GoF.
The frame around could be faked, perhaps even the Shack/slope
background, but the photo of the two together looks genuine.

Looking at it closer, it almost appears that she is tying his shoe...
(although doing that with thick winter mittens might be tricky.)
Sleepy
2004-02-16 20:25:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
I'd always pictured someone like Rufus Sewell - a bit like he was in Dark
City.
But David Thewlis is a decent actor - I'm sure he'll do a decent job. I
reckon
Gary Oldman will be great - he's wild enough to make you think Sirius is a
bad
guy even if you've read the book.
Fish Eye no Miko
2004-02-16 20:35:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sleepy
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by Sleepy
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
David Thewlis is a decent actor - I'm sure he'll do a decent job.
I've not seen anyone disparage Thewlis' acting, it's the appearance of the
character that people dislike.
Seriously, who was responsible for this, and what were they thinking?
I mean I can see this:
Loading Image...
Or:
Loading Image...
But what they've got? No.
Post by Sleepy
I reckon Gary Oldman will be great
<slight spoiler snipped>

Totally. I think they picked the prefect guy to be Sirius.

Catherine Johnson. Look--a related .sig quote!
--
fenm at cox dot net
"DENETHOR INSANITY METER = YOUR AVERAGE GARY OLDMAN CHARACTER"
-From Evadne's "LotR: Return of the King: Breadbox Edition", on
fanfiction.net.
yak
2004-02-16 21:18:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Post by Sleepy
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by Sleepy
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
David Thewlis is a decent actor - I'm sure he'll do a decent job.
I've not seen anyone disparage Thewlis' acting, it's the appearance of the
character that people dislike.
Seriously, who was responsible for this, and what were they thinking?
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/9633/misc14.gif
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/9633/misc5.jpg
But what they've got? No.
Post by Sleepy
I reckon Gary Oldman will be great
<slight spoiler snipped>
Totally. I think they picked the prefect guy to be Sirius.
Catherine Johnson. Look--a related .sig quote!
I always wanted Colin Firth as Sirius... While I like Oldman and think
he is a great actor, I think Firth more closely fits the part
physically.
BigRed
2004-02-18 16:38:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sleepy
I'd always pictured someone like Rufus Sewell - a bit like he was in Dark
City.
I do not know his work but his picture on imdb.com looks exactly as I
always pictured him while reading the books.

See it here:
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001722/

P.S. OT
Trying Thoth news reader.
Looks good so far.
Ze alluring ailurophile
2004-02-16 21:26:24 UTC
Permalink
Subject: Disappointing Lupin Photo
Date: 2/16/2004 1:03 PM Eastern Standard Time
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Sigh.....I don't know why they chose him. He's a wonderful actor, just *not*
what I envision Remus to look like. Gary Oldman would have been great as Remus
instead of Sirius, IMO. Remus has a certain sensitivity to his character that
the producers really should have focused on.
Meanwhile, this photo looks like a keeper for the Harry/Hermione
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide3.jpg
And finally, a portrait of Harry with messy hair, as the books
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide5.jpg
Now if only they would get his eyes the right color... In a world of
CGI magic (not to mention contact lenses), how hard could it be to
make his eyes green??
n***@nospam.com
2004-02-17 00:39:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
actually I had.

I got the impression that he was a harmless looking fellow. maybe a bit
thinner but pretty much about right
unknown
2004-02-17 04:11:06 UTC
Permalink
Sure thin, but he also needs to be tattered and haggard. While the
pictures that I have seen are not the height of wizzard fashion, he
does not look run down and frayed enough. There should be more wear
on his clothes and face. He should be likeable, but not "cute".

BigRed
Post by n***@nospam.com
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by n***@nospam.com
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
actually I had.
I got the impression that he was a harmless looking fellow. maybe a bit
thinner but pretty much about right
stark
2004-02-17 15:59:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Now if only they would get his eyes the right color... In a world of
CGI magic (not to mention contact lenses), how hard could it be to
make his eyes green??
It would be very tedious, very difficult to make it appear natural, and
very costly.

For LoTR, Orlando Bloom's normally brown eyes needed to be a fantastic blue
color to complete the whole "uber-cool elf" appearance. They apparently
thought about doing it all in CG, but even they decided it wasn't feasible.
Instead they created contacts for Orlando to wear. He wore them whenever
the camera would be close enough to show his eye color. Apparently he found
them really uncomfortable, and Weta still went back and changed some shots
where he was not wearing the contacts. They said that overall it was a very
unpleasant thing.

Apparently Danial Radcliffe had similar problems with contacts, and WB
didn't want to spend the money to cover the CG work. Furthermore, from what
we've seen of the HP movies, the effects studios they have doing the work
simply do not have the ability to pull off such subtle work while retaining
a realistic appearance.
--
737461726B3A30322F31372F3034203130353323696E636C756465203C6373746469
6F3E0A23696E636C756465203C756E697374642E683E0A6D61696E28297B666F7228
6368617220632C693D2D313B7265616428302C26632C31293B69253D333429707269
6E74662822257325303258222C2B2B693D3D33343F225C6E223A22222C63293B7D0A
Markku Uttula
2004-02-18 21:45:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Frankly; nope. The looks of Lupin of PoA, the movie more remind me of
my minds image that I had of Gilderoy Lockhart before the movie.
Speaking of Lockhart, for some reason the "allow me", stunt by Lupin
during the boggart scene in the new teaser is so Lockhartisque as
anything can be. The maneuvres :)

Here is how Lupin looks like through my inner eye (the image is from
the movie "Restoration")

Loading Image...
--
Markku Uttula
gjw
2004-02-19 02:55:04 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:45:43 +0200, "Markku Uttula"
Post by gjw
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Post by gjw
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
Frankly; nope. The looks of Lupin of PoA, the movie more remind me of
my minds image that I had of Gilderoy Lockhart before the movie.
I'm glad someone said that. I was thinking exactly the same thing when
I saw the photo.
DM
2004-02-19 02:42:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by gjw
Why, oh why, did they do this to Lupin?
http://pwogalerie.funnelle.com/galleries/Les_films/Harry_Potter_3/Guide1.jpg
Did anyone reading the books picture Remus Lupin to look like that?
What the feck is that on his lip?
--
DM
---

,_,
(O,O)
( )
-"-"-

---
"RUN, SCABBERS, RUN!" - Jenny LeStrange
"My momma always told me, Evil is as Evil does..." - Voldemort Gump

HPCode(v1.1) S PS++COS++POA+++*GOF+++OOTP+++FF= QA
CH+++DD+++HB-HM+*PO+++TR+AR++CM++ HP/He-RW/Ch-CC/Mn-FW/GW/Ol-NL/Fl-SS/Um-VK/Ka
Continue reading on narkive:
Loading...