That Glorious Death

[Sirius Kase]

I was fully expecting one of our good guys to die a glorious death,
that is where either causing much damage to the bad guys or saving
Harry or other VIP good guy. My chief candidates were Harry (while
saving everyone), Neville (while vanquishing Belatrix), or Lupin
(going one on one with Fenrir). Well, Harry and Nevile were heroic,
but they lived, whereas we don't know how Lupin died.

So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

[Richard Eney]

Post by Sirius Kase
I was fully expecting one of our good guys to die a glorious death,
that is where either causing much damage to the bad guys or saving
Harry or other VIP good guy. My chief candidates were Harry (while
saving everyone), Neville (while vanquishing Belatrix), or Lupin
(going one on one with Fenrir). Well, Harry and Neville were heroic,
but they lived, whereas we don't know how Lupin died.
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Good catch. I suppose it might be said that Harry died nobly, since he
didn't know he'd be coming back. Since it was in battle, we can assume
that Lupin and Tonks died gloriously, probably fighting werewolves.

So the big hero is Dobby the loyal servant, dying to save his freely-
chosen master, following in the footsteps of so many loyal servants
in fantasy stories. At least he got to have green eyes. The sidekicks
usually have brown eyes and hair, like Hermione. (The protagonist, as
usual, connects with the redhead, though she, too, has brown eyes, for
contrast with Harry's green eyes.)

=Tamar

[Drusilla]

Post by Sirius Kase
I was fully expecting one of our good guys to die a glorious death,
that is where either causing much damage to the bad guys or saving
Harry or other VIP good guy. My chief candidates were Harry (while
saving everyone), Neville (while vanquishing Belatrix), or Lupin
(going one on one with Fenrir). Well, Harry and Nevile were heroic,
but they lived, whereas we don't know how Lupin died.
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier to
me now.

Fred, lupin, tonks and the others that die at the battle of Hogwarts
also died trying to protect their loved ones but it wasn't in a specific
action as Dobby.

[Tweedle Dee]

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier to
me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

-TD

[santosh]

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving
Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier
to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion one,
obviously.

[Toon]

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving
Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier
to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion one,
obviously.

I thought that was SPEW?

[Sirius Kase]

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving
Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier
to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion one,
obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning. An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving some
of the most important characters of the story, and the conditioned
reader laughs.

[santosh]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving
Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even
funnier to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion
one, obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning. An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving some
of the most important characters of the story, and the conditioned
reader laughs.

Err, actually I was trying to explain why _some_ people might find
Dobby's death funny. I certainly did not. All the three deaths we were
actually made witness to in DH were quite sober episodes, even that of
the owl.

[Sirius Kase]

Post by santosh

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving
Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even
funnier to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion
one, obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning. An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving some
of the most important characters of the story, and the conditioned
reader laughs.

Err, actually I was trying to explain why _some_ people might find
Dobby's death funny. I certainly did not. All the three deaths we were
actually made witness to in DH were quite sober episodes, even that of
the owl.

As was I. I didn't name names. I must admit that I didn't think of
Dobby right off the bat as being a hero. It really is hard to take
the elves as seriously as humans. Although I didn't laugh when Dobby
or Hedwig died, it wasn't as sad for me as the deaths of Lupin, Tonks,
Fred, or even Snape. They just aren't human.

[santosh]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while
saving Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even
funnier to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion
one, obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning.
An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving
some of the most important characters of the story, and the
conditioned reader laughs.

Err, actually I was trying to explain why _some_ people might find
Dobby's death funny. I certainly did not. All the three deaths we
were actually made witness to in DH were quite sober episodes, even
that of the owl.

As was I. I didn't name names. I must admit that I didn't think of
Dobby right off the bat as being a hero. It really is hard to take
the elves as seriously as humans. Although I didn't laugh when Dobby
or Hedwig died, it wasn't as sad for me as the deaths of Lupin, Tonks,
Fred, or even Snape. They just aren't human.

Do you find the death of a small child sadder than the death of an adult
person? If so why? Is it because of a perceived "innocence" of the
child, as compared to the adult. The adult often knows what he is
getting into, often has an idea of what is to befall him. The child has
no such knowledge. It is merely pitifully bewildered and terrified of
what is happening to it.

Extending this line of thought it could be argued that animals are
as "innocent", if not more so, than children and hence their deaths are
often sadder than a human', particularly when the animal is an
evolutionarily advanced one like a cat, dog, horse etc.

[Sirius Kase]

Post by santosh

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while
saving Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even
funnier to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion
one, obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning.
An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving
some of the most important characters of the story, and the
conditioned reader laughs.

Err, actually I was trying to explain why _some_ people might find
Dobby's death funny. I certainly did not. All the three deaths we
were actually made witness to in DH were quite sober episodes, even
that of the owl.

As was I. I didn't name names. I must admit that I didn't think of
Dobby right off the bat as being a hero. It really is hard to take
the elves as seriously as humans. Although I didn't laugh when Dobby
or Hedwig died, it wasn't as sad for me as the deaths of Lupin, Tonks,
Fred, or even Snape. They just aren't human.

Do you find the death of a small child sadder than the death of an adult
person?

Not...

Post by santosh
If so why? Is it because of a perceived "innocence" of the
child, as compared to the adult. The adult often knows what he is
getting into, often has an idea of what is to befall him. The child has
no such knowledge. It is merely pitifully bewildered and terrified of
what is happening to it.

What is this about? Why directed at me? I easily feel much sadder
when children lose their parents than when parents lose their
children, although losing my children would be unbearable. Growing
old without your children is tragic, but growing up without your
parents can be impossible.

Post by santosh
Extending this line of thought it could be argued that animals are
as "innocent", if not more so, than children and hence their deaths are
often sadder than a human', particularly when the animal is an
evolutionarily advanced one like a cat, dog, horse etc.

Why extend something that doesn't make sense? If you must extend, why
don't you discuss how this applies to HP or house elves? Are you
saying dead elves are like dead dogs and are therefore more tragic
than dead children which in turn are more tragic than dead adults?

[Sirius Kase]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while
saving Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even
funnier to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion
one, obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning.
An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving
some of the most important characters of the story, and the
conditioned reader laughs.

Err, actually I was trying to explain why _some_ people might find
Dobby's death funny. I certainly did not. All the three deaths we
were actually made witness to in DH were quite sober episodes, even
that of the owl.

As was I. I didn't name names. I must admit that I didn't think of
Dobby right off the bat as being a hero. It really is hard to take
the elves as seriously as humans. Although I didn't laugh when Dobby
or Hedwig died, it wasn't as sad for me as the deaths of Lupin, Tonks,
Fred, or even Snape. They just aren't human.

Do you find the death of a small child sadder than the death of an adult
person?

Not...

Post by santosh
If so why? Is it because of a perceived "innocence" of the
child, as compared to the adult. The adult often knows what he is
getting into, often has an idea of what is to befall him. The child has
no such knowledge. It is merely pitifully bewildered and terrified of
what is happening to it.

What is this about? Why directed at me? I easily feel much sadder
when children lose their parents than when parents lose their
children, although losing my children would be unbearable. Growing
old without your children is tragic, but growing up without your
parents can be impossible.

Post by santosh
Extending this line of thought it could be argued that animals are
as "innocent", if not more so, than children and hence their deaths are
often sadder than a human', particularly when the animal is an
evolutionarily advanced one like a cat, dog, horse etc.

Why extend something that doesn't make sense? If you must extend, why
don't you discuss how this applies to HP or house elves? Are you
saying dead elves are like dead dogs and are therefore more tragic
than dead children which in turn are more tragic than dead adults?

BTW, when I say children, I mean little people who can't survive on
their own without a parent or a guardian. It's sad when your parent's
die, but if you are an adult, you should be able to deal with it even
easier than if your children die. After, all, that's the normal
condition, for parents of adult children to die. Didn't say easy,
just easier to deal with what is normal than what is unusual, like
being orphaned. BTW, I have know several people who where orphaned
when they were minors and absolutely none of them liked their
guardians. I hope I don't die, because I would hate for my kids to
hate the people who are now their favorite aunt and uncle.

[Toon]

On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 20:30:04 -0800 (PST), Sirius Kase

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving
Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even
funnier to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion
one, obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning. An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving some
of the most important characters of the story, and the conditioned
reader laughs.

Err, actually I was trying to explain why _some_ people might find
Dobby's death funny. I certainly did not. All the three deaths we were
actually made witness to in DH were quite sober episodes, even that of
the owl.

As was I. I didn't name names. I must admit that I didn't think of
Dobby right off the bat as being a hero. It really is hard to take
the elves as seriously as humans. Although I didn't laugh when Dobby
or Hedwig died, it wasn't as sad for me as the deaths of Lupin, Tonks,
Fred, or even Snape. They just aren't human.

Lupi and Tonks didn't affect me because it was after the fact. Blah
Blah Blah, oh the Lupins died too. Blah Blah Blah. Not real. Fred,
Dobby, Hedwig, Snape, they are real, because we "see" it.

[DaveD]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving
Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even
funnier to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion
one, obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning. An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving some
of the most important characters of the story, and the conditioned
reader laughs.

Err, actually I was trying to explain why _some_ people might find
Dobby's death funny. I certainly did not. All the three deaths we were
actually made witness to in DH were quite sober episodes, even that of
the owl.

As was I. I didn't name names. I must admit that I didn't think of
Dobby right off the bat as being a hero. It really is hard to take
the elves as seriously as humans. Although I didn't laugh when Dobby
or Hedwig died, it wasn't as sad for me as the deaths of Lupin, Tonks,
Fred, or even Snape. They just aren't human.

Really? That doesn't make a difference to me - but I've always been an
animal lover (though not I hasten to add, in any Aberforthian way!)

I found Hedwig's death the saddest in the whole of DH (not that that was
difficult - many of the rest were too rushed to be able to emote: Madeye,
Lupin and Tonks, and Feorge - or was it Gred?!) and the second saddest in
the whole series.

The saddest for me in the whole series was Dd - it just knocked me for six
when I read it. Whereas Sirius' just didn't bother me for some reason - I
don't know if it was because he'd been written with a bit too much
negativity for me so I didn't really relate to him enough to feel that bad
about his death or if it was the anti-climactic manner of it, falling
through the veil when stupefied or whatever, rather than, say, AKed
outright. But I wasn't that upset.

DaveD

[Edward McArdle]

Post by DaveD
The saddest for me in the whole series was Dd - it just knocked me for six
when I read it. Whereas Sirius' just didn't bother me for some reason - I
don't know if it was because he'd been written with a bit too much
negativity for me so I didn't really relate to him enough to feel that bad
about his death or if it was the anti-climactic manner of it, falling
through the veil when stupefied or whatever, rather than, say, AKed
outright. But I wasn't that upset.
DaveD

I didn't find it at all sad. He was dying, achieving what he wanted,
after a long life. Something similar for Sirius - he died fighting for
his nephew.
I found Lupin and Tonks more upsetting. They had found happiness
together, and then they died.

[DaveD]

Post by Edward McArdle

Post by DaveD
The saddest for me in the whole series was Dd - it just knocked me for six
when I read it. Whereas Sirius' just didn't bother me for some reason - I
don't know if it was because he'd been written with a bit too much
negativity for me so I didn't really relate to him enough to feel that bad
about his death or if it was the anti-climactic manner of it, falling
through the veil when stupefied or whatever, rather than, say, AKed
outright. But I wasn't that upset.
DaveD

I didn't find it at all sad. He was dying, achieving what he wanted,
after a long life. Something similar for Sirius - he died fighting for
his nephew.
I found Lupin and Tonks more upsetting. They had found happiness
together, and then they died.

Logically you're correct. But I think that says something about the quality
of the writing of it, which meant that I was very upset by Dd's death (who
we had also known quite well for 6 books) but I didn't know L&T as well and
their deaths were written almost as if they were announced as an
afterthought: "oh yeah, L&T died too" sort of thing. I think that's why I
felt differently.

DaveD

[Toon]

On Mon, 03 Dec 2007 18:15:23 GMT, "DaveD"

Post by DaveD

Post by Edward McArdle

Post by DaveD
The saddest for me in the whole series was Dd - it just knocked me for six
when I read it. Whereas Sirius' just didn't bother me for some reason - I
don't know if it was because he'd been written with a bit too much
negativity for me so I didn't really relate to him enough to feel that bad
about his death or if it was the anti-climactic manner of it, falling
through the veil when stupefied or whatever, rather than, say, AKed
outright. But I wasn't that upset.
DaveD

I didn't find it at all sad. He was dying, achieving what he wanted,
after a long life. Something similar for Sirius - he died fighting for
his nephew.
I found Lupin and Tonks more upsetting. They had found happiness
together, and then they died.

Logically you're correct. But I think that says something about the quality
of the writing of it, which meant that I was very upset by Dd's death (who
we had also known quite well for 6 books) but I didn't know L&T as well and
their deaths were written almost as if they were announced as an
afterthought: "oh yeah, L&T died too" sort of thing. I think that's why I
felt differently.
DaveD

Yup. Might as well did an epilogue with a page in the Daly prophet
listing the dead. Yeah so? I mean, who cried when Amiela Bones was
murdered? Or the Muggles Studies teacher at the start of DH? Did
that really affect people? I kept wondering who she was. And now we
have Harry noticing the Lupins in the pile of dead people. Ok, they
apparently died. But we don't see how. We don't know who did it.
Harry barely cries. It's nothing. Which isn't very fair to Lupin.

[Toon]

On Mon, 03 Dec 2007 13:46:18 +1100, Edward McArdle

Post by Edward McArdle
I found Lupin and Tonks more upsetting. They had found happiness
together, and then they died.

I wish they could have gotten transferred to a better hospital, where
their condition could have been upgraded to alive.

Their's was the most unfair, because Teddy didn't need to be the
orphan. A new character, part of the order with his wife, could have
also sufficed. Maybe he helps Harry, so Harry takes it upon himself
to tell Jr.

[Toon]

On Sun, 02 Dec 2007 18:24:38 GMT, "DaveD"

Post by DaveD
I found Hedwig's death the saddest in the whole of DH

I didn't, because it seemed off page. Really, the cage could of
opened, and she could have escaped. Harry thought she died, but who
knows if he could see clearly. As time at the Weasleys passed, I knew
she had indeed died.

[Green-Eyed Chris]

In article

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by santosh

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving
Harry, Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier
to me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Probably because the entire House-Elf concept is a comic diversion one,
obviously.

There was nothing funny about Dobby's role in Deathly Hallows. I
believe some readers have been victims of pavlovian conditioning. An
elf appears and does something funny so they laugh. It happens again,
and they laugh. Then an elf appears and the reader laughs anyway even
when nothing funny happens. Then, an elf appears and dies saving some
of the most important characters of the story, and the conditioned
reader laughs.

Good point, but it was different for me. I believe his speech simply
annoyed me from the start and the Putin face he was given in the movie
didn't help. I always loathed the elves a little bit and SPEW nailed it
for the rest of the series.
--
Chris

[David Sueme]

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla
Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier to
me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Correct me if I am wrong, Dru - but I think ideas that Dru is after
are "maladroit", "cheap sentimentality", "maudlin" - particularly the
last. The whole burial bit is such an obvious appeal to miserable
weepy sentimentality that while Dru was laughing at the irony I was
thinking in terms of "consumer fraud".

Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund. And at the end I'm rewarded with
this?

Dave

[Toon]

On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

[Drusilla]

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help :P

[Sirius Kase]

Post by Drusilla

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help :P

Maybe I should donate my son's trebuchet to the cause? He just built
it for an english project. Possibly for returning his library books,
I'm not sure.

[santosh]

Post by Drusilla

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help :P

And I have a working reconstruction of Jules Verne's canon.
:-)

[Richard Eney]

Post by santosh

Post by Drusilla

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help :P

And I have a working reconstruction of Jules Verne's canon.
:-)

What, all of it? The submarine too?

=Tamar

[Sirius Kase]

Post by Richard Eney

Post by santosh

Post by Drusilla

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help :P

And I have a working reconstruction of Jules Verne's canon.
:-)

What, all of it? The submarine too?
=Tamar

That's the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Mainly because I
did not catch santosh's typo the first time. Cannon, Canon, it's all
the same to me, especially now that i've adapted to afhp speak.

[Drusilla]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by Richard Eney

Post by santosh

Post by Drusilla

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help :P

And I have a working reconstruction of Jules Verne's canon.
:-)

What, all of it? The submarine too?
=Tamar

That's the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Mainly because I
did not catch santosh's typo the first time. Cannon, Canon, it's all
the same to me, especially now that i've adapted to afhp speak.

LOL, same thing here. I just read the typo...

[Ron Hunter]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by Richard Eney

Post by santosh

Post by Drusilla

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help :P

And I have a working reconstruction of Jules Verne's canon.
:-)

What, all of it? The submarine too?
=Tamar

That's the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Mainly because I
did not catch santosh's typo the first time. Cannon, Canon, it's all
the same to me, especially now that i've adapted to afhp speak.

Humm. Much in spelling is trivial, but I can certainly say I would
rather have a Canon (camera) go off in my face than a cannon!

[Louis Epstein]

Ron Hunter <***@charter.net> wrote:
: Sirius Kase wrote:
:> On Dec 2, 1:53 pm, ***@radix.net (Richard Eney) wrote:
:>> In article <fipinp$***@registered.motzarella.org>,
:>>
:>>
:>>
:>> santosh <***@gmail.com> wrote:
:>>> Drusilla wrote:
:>>>> Toon escribi?:
:>>>>> On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme
:>>>>> <***@comcast.net> wrote:
:>>>>>> Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
:>>>>>> Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.
:>>>>> Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
:>>>>> rhymes. Toon. Moon.
:>>>> Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help
:>>>> :P
:>>> And I have a working reconstruction of Jules Verne's canon.
:>>> :-)
:>> What, all of it? The submarine too?
:>>
:>> =Tamar
:>
:> That's the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Mainly because I
:> did not catch santosh's typo the first time. Cannon, Canon, it's all
:> the same to me, especially now that i've adapted to afhp speak.
:
: Humm. Much in spelling is trivial, but I can certainly say I would
: rather have a Canon (camera) go off in my face than a cannon!

What does church law say about such situations?
I haven't memorized the canons.

-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

[Welsh Dog]

Post by Louis Epstein
:>>>>> On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme
:>>>>>> Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
:>>>>>> Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.
:>>>>> Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
:>>>>> rhymes. Toon. Moon.
:>>>> Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might help
:>>>> :P
:>>> And I have a working reconstruction of Jules Verne's canon.
:>>> :-)
:>> What, all of it? The submarine too?
:> That's the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Mainly because I
:> did not catch santosh's typo the first time. Cannon, Canon, it's all
:> the same to me, especially now that i've adapted to afhp speak.

Good catch tho! :)

Post by Louis Epstein
: Humm. Much in spelling is trivial, but I can certainly say I would
: rather have a Canon (camera) go off in my face than a cannon!
What does church law say about such situations?
I haven't memorized the canons.

Why would you want to remember their names?

Welshdog

[santosh]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by Richard Eney

Post by santosh

Post by Drusilla

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the
"send Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Might I interest you in the old catapult I have at home? It might
help
:P

And I have a working reconstruction of Jules Verne's canon.
:-)

What, all of it? The submarine too?
=Tamar

That's the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Mainly because I
did not catch santosh's typo the first time. Cannon, Canon, it's all
the same to me, especially now that i've adapted to afhp speak.

Yikes! I didn't even notice that until your comment!

There are typos and there are typos. :-)

[Sirius Kase]

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Yeah, and I'm sure you'd make a great nanny for the kids. Don't
forget your umbrella..

[David Sueme]

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Sorry - that doesn't quite earn a donation. For I thought Rowling was
earning my donations, but I have had a hard time feeling that way
recently.

Dave

[DaveD]

Post by David Sueme

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Sorry - that doesn't quite earn a donation. For I thought Rowling was
earning my donations, but I have had a hard time feeling that way
recently.
Dave

But think about the good your donations have done for the kids, which (for
me anyway) would have been the main rationale for giving. You might want to
give to a different charity in future, but it's not like the money was
wasted - it will still have achieved good outcomes.

DaveD

[Drusilla]

Post by DaveD

Post by David Sueme

Post by Toon
On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund.

Might I interest you in the send Toon to the moon, too, fund? it
rhymes. Toon. Moon.

Sorry - that doesn't quite earn a donation. For I thought Rowling was
earning my donations, but I have had a hard time feeling that way
recently.
Dave

But think about the good your donations have done for the kids, which
(for me anyway) would have been the main rationale for giving. You
might want to give to a different charity in future, but it's not like
the money was wasted - it will still have achieved good outcomes.

When I think about it, reading HP was waaaaaaaay cheaper than paying for
real English lessons. And I learned faster. I can't complain, then.

[David Sueme]

Post by DaveD
But think about the good your donations have done for the kids,

I love kids medium rare. They are so cute with an apple in thier
mouth.

Nothing is better with pumpkin juice than kid.

Dave

[Ron Hunter]

Post by David Sueme

Post by DaveD
But think about the good your donations have done for the kids,

I love kids medium rare. They are so cute with an apple in thier
mouth.
Nothing is better with pumpkin juice than kid.
Dave

thanks, Dave, I needed that image nice and early in the morning....

[Drusilla]

Post by David Sueme

Post by DaveD
But think about the good your donations have done for the kids,

I love kids medium rare. They are so cute with an apple in thier
mouth.
Nothing is better with pumpkin juice than kid.

Old joke, even for me. Yet, still is a good punchline, anyway.

"I like kids"

"Me too, with onion and potatoes".

[Toon]

On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 00:45:52 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme

Post by DaveD
But think about the good your donations have done for the kids,

I love kids medium rare. They are so cute with an apple in thier
mouth.
Nothing is better with pumpkin juice than kid.
Dave

Aberforth isn't going to like that, Dave.

[Bill Blakely]

On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla
Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier to
me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Correct me if I am wrong, Dru - but I think ideas that Dru is after
are "maladroit", "cheap sentimentality", "maudlin" - particularly the
last. The whole burial bit is such an obvious appeal to miserable
weepy sentimentality that while Dru was laughing at the irony I was
thinking in terms of "consumer fraud".
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund. And at the end I'm rewarded with
this?
Dave

-----------------------------------------------
George W. Bush: Billions for Halliburton but not one cent for children's health care.

[Bill Blakely]

On Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:30:40 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme

Post by Tweedle Dee

Post by Drusilla
Yep. Dobby. Which for some reason, makes his death scene even funnier to
me now.

Er... why did you find Dobby's death scene funny in the first place?

Correct me if I am wrong, Dru - but I think ideas that Dru is after
are "maladroit", "cheap sentimentality", "maudlin" - particularly the
last. The whole burial bit is such an obvious appeal to miserable
weepy sentimentality that while Dru was laughing at the irony I was
thinking in terms of "consumer fraud".
Over the years I've donated close to a hundred dollars to the "send
Rowling's kids to the moon" fund. And at the end I'm rewarded with
this?
Dave

That's precisely why I find it best not to think about DH too much!
(And HBP, too, for that matter>)

Maudlin though it was, Dobby's death was the most touching in DH, but
it was the best of a bad lot.

If JKR just had to kill off Lupin, the least she could have done was
to give him a death scene, and he would have been a natural for a
glorious one.


-----------------------------------------------
George W. Bush: Billions for Halliburton but not one cent for children's health care.

[Toon]

On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 13:32:04 -0500, Bill Blakely

Post by Bill Blakely
If JKR just had to kill off Lupin, the least she could have done was
to give him a death scene, and he would have been a natural for a
glorious one.

What could be better than killing Fenrir, thus breaking his curse,
only to then be killed?

[Bill Blakely]

Post by Toon
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 13:32:04 -0500, Bill Blakely

Post by Bill Blakely
If JKR just had to kill off Lupin, the least she could have done was
to give him a death scene, and he would have been a natural for a
glorious one.

What could be better than killing Fenrir, thus breaking his curse,
only to then be killed?

Works for me!!


-----------------------------------------------
George W. Bush: Billions for Halliburton but not one cent for children's health care.

[Toon]

On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:04:41 -0800 (PST), Sirius Kase

Post by Sirius Kase
but they lived, whereas we don't know how Lupin died.

Unfairly. If she wanted an orphan, she could have created a whole new
family. She killed the Lupins for a plot point.

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Snape? He died trying to help Harry secretly from behind enemy lines.

[Sirius Kase]

Post by Toon
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:04:41 -0800 (PST), Sirius Kase

Post by Sirius Kase
but they lived, whereas we don't know how Lupin died.

Unfairly. If she wanted an orphan, she could have created a whole new
family. She killed the Lupins for a plot point.

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Snape? He died trying to help Harry secretly from behind enemy lines.

Yes, he died secretly in the shack without even putting up a fight.
He did not die in glory. At the time of his death, he was hated by
both sides.

His death did have a single witness, and the epilogue suggests that he
may want to repair Snape's reputation, but I'm not sure even Harry
Potter has that much political capital.

[Richard Eney]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by Toon
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:04:41 -0800 (PST), Sirius Kase

Post by Sirius Kase
but they lived, whereas we don't know how Lupin died.

Unfairly. If she wanted an orphan, she could have created a whole new
family. She killed the Lupins for a plot point.

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Snape? He died trying to help Harry secretly from behind enemy lines.

Yes, he died secretly in the shack without even putting up a fight.
He did not die in glory. At the time of his death, he was hated by
both sides.

I would say that Snape died almost the same way Sirius died - still
fighting, but in his own way. Snape was trying to get away from Voldemort
without breaking cover so that he could contact Harry and give him the word.

Post by Sirius Kase
His death did have a single witness, and the epilogue suggests that he
may want to repair Snape's reputation, but I'm not sure even Harry
Potter has that much political capital.

It has to have had some effect that he named his son after Snape and
also freely talks about him positively. I don't think Harry restricts
his comments to the children. He's had 17 years to talk up Snape at work
and in interviews, and as head of the Aurors he must have made a lot of
public announcements.

=Tamar

[Toon]

Post by Richard Eney
It has to have had some effect that he named his son after Snape and
also freely talks about him positively. I don't think Harry restricts
his comments to the children. He's had 17 years to talk up Snape at work
and in interviews, and as head of the Aurors he must have made a lot of
public announcements.

As long as he doesn't abuse that power. This just in. Ginny has a
nice bum. That is all.

Ah, cheap anniversary gifts.

[Rob Strom]

On Nov 29, 12:46 pm, Sirius Kase <***@gmail.com> wrote:
...

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by Toon
Snape? He died trying to help Harry secretly from behind enemy lines.

Yes, he died secretly in the shack without even putting up a fight.
He did not die in glory. At the time of his death, he was hated by
both sides.
His death did have a single witness, and the epilogue suggests that he
may want to repair Snape's reputation, but I'm not sure even Harry
Potter has that much political capital.

Snape's conversations with Dumbledore are saved in Dumbledore's
Pensieve; wouldn't that make them a public record corroborating
Harry's story of Snape's role? (In fact they are Harry's own source
for
his story of Snape's role.)

--
Rob Strom

[Sirius Kase]

Post by Rob Strom
...

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by Toon
Snape? He died trying to help Harry secretly from behind enemy lines.

Yes, he died secretly in the shack without even putting up a fight.
He did not die in glory. At the time of his death, he was hated by
both sides.
His death did have a single witness, and the epilogue suggests that he
may want to repair Snape's reputation, but I'm not sure even Harry
Potter has that much political capital.

Snape's conversations with Dumbledore are saved in Dumbledore's
Pensieve; wouldn't that make them a public record corroborating
Harry's story of Snape's role? (In fact they are Harry's own source
for
his story of Snape's role.)

yes, although Snape did not die in glory, Harry has enough evidence to
petition for Snape to receive that Order of Merlin posthumously.
Assuming pensieves and such are legally accepted recordings.

[David Sueme]

This post might be inappropriate. Click to display it.

[Ron Hunter]

Post by David Sueme

Post by Rob Strom
Snape's conversations with Dumbledore are saved in Dumbledore's
Pensieve; wouldn't that make them a public record corroborating
Harry's story of Snape's role? (In fact they are Harry's own source
for
his story of Snape's role.)

Realistically, this is surely beyond what JKR had imagined when the
book was published, just as "gay" Dumbledore was beyond the scope at
the time the last book was published.
But, playing along, I'll argue that the Pensieve is not acceptable as
evidence in court. Dumbledore retrieved a pensieve-like memory
recording from Slughorn that was in part fraudulent. Arguably, Sluggy
did a poor job of covering up because he was ashamed. A more perfect
sociopath, then, might well make a better job of creating counterfit
memories. He could either sprinkle his couterfits into other wizard's
records - or, if he was a magical genius like DD, he could create a
pensieve that is entirely fiction. The magical equivalent of a muggle
accountant's* "cooked books".
Dave
* Is "muggle accountant" a redundancy?

If one's testimony from memory is valid, then why should pensieve
evidence, obtained nearer the actual event, be excluded? People lie in
testimony all the time. It is up to the judge, or jury, to determine
what seems consistent with documented facts.

[Toon]

On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 01:17:49 -0800 (PST), David Sueme

Post by David Sueme

Post by Rob Strom
Snape's conversations with Dumbledore are saved in Dumbledore's
Pensieve; wouldn't that make them a public record corroborating
Harry's story of Snape's role? (In fact they are Harry's own source
for
his story of Snape's role.)

Realistically, this is surely beyond what JKR had imagined when the
book was published, just as "gay" Dumbledore was beyond the scope at
the time the last book was published.
But, playing along, I'll argue that the Pensieve is not acceptable as
evidence in court. Dumbledore retrieved a pensieve-like memory
recording from Slughorn that was in part fraudulent. Arguably, Sluggy
did a poor job of covering up because he was ashamed. A more perfect
sociopath, then, might well make a better job of creating counterfit
memories. He could either sprinkle his couterfits into other wizard's
records - or, if he was a magical genius like DD, he could create a
pensieve that is entirely fiction. The magical equivalent of a muggle
accountant's* "cooked books".
Dave
* Is "muggle accountant" a redundancy?

No, there are squib accountants.

[Rob Strom]

Post by David Sueme

Post by Rob Strom
Snape's conversations with Dumbledore are saved in Dumbledore's
Pensieve; wouldn't that make them a public record corroborating
Harry's story of Snape's role? (In fact they are Harry's own source
for
his story of Snape's role.)

Realistically, this is surely beyond what JKR had imagined when the
book was published, just as "gay" Dumbledore was beyond the scope at
the time the last book was published.

I'm not sure we can determine which inferences from the book
were explicitly imagined by JKR.

I would have thought that since Harry named a child after Snape,
and lauded his bravery to that child, it would be at least consistent
with the canon that Harry probably would have told others
why he named a child after a presumed enemy, and possibly
even let others view some of the events for themselves.

Post by David Sueme
But, playing along, I'll argue that the Pensieve is not acceptable as
evidence in court.

I was under the impression that we weren't talking about a formal
trial
in court. I thought we were talking about Harry rehabilitating
Snape's reputation by inviting people to view the preserved memories
in the Pensieve.

--
Rob Strom

[Toon]

On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 15:07:37 -0800 (PST), Rob Strom

Post by Rob Strom
I would have thought that since Harry named a child after Snape,
and lauded his bravery to that child, it would be at least consistent
with the canon that Harry probably would have told others
why he named a child after a presumed enemy, and possibly
even let others view some of the events for themselves.

But how often does one mention the middle names? If not for the trial
in OOP, there'd be no mention of Harry James in the book. Without
JK's interview, we'd have never even known it. Is it therefore
reasonable to assume Harry would tell anybody why his second son's
name is Albus Severus?

And what of little James? We know not his middle name, but, can any
of us buy Harry not naming him James Sirius? Really, all we got to go
on is Albus Severus. If one son has such important figures in Harry's
life as a name sake, surely James must be James Sirius.

[Louis Epstein]

Toon <***@toon.com> wrote:
: On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 15:07:37 -0800 (PST), Rob Strom
: <***@watson.ibm.com> wrote:
:
:>I would have thought that since Harry named a child after Snape,
:>and lauded his bravery to that child, it would be at least consistent
:>with the canon that Harry probably would have told others
:>why he named a child after a presumed enemy, and possibly
:>even let others view some of the events for themselves.
:
: But how often does one mention the middle names? If not for the trial
: in OOP, there'd be no mention of Harry James in the book. Without
: JK's interview, we'd have never even known it. Is it therefore
: reasonable to assume Harry would tell anybody why his second son's
: name is Albus Severus?
:
: And what of little James? We know not his middle name, but, can any
: of us buy Harry not naming him James Sirius? Really, all we got to go
: on is Albus Severus. If one son has such important figures in Harry's
: life as a name sake, surely James must be James Sirius.

[Rowling has in fact confirmed "James Sirius"...and also "Lily Luna",
which disappointed me because I'd assumed she was "Lily Ginevra" since
Ginny had HER mother's name as her middle name].

-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

[DaveD]

Post by David Sueme

Post by Rob Strom
Snape's conversations with Dumbledore are saved in Dumbledore's
Pensieve; wouldn't that make them a public record corroborating
Harry's story of Snape's role? (In fact they are Harry's own source
for
his story of Snape's role.)

Realistically, this is surely beyond what JKR had imagined when the
book was published, just as "gay" Dumbledore was beyond the scope at
the time the last book was published.
But, playing along, I'll argue that the Pensieve is not acceptable as
evidence in court. Dumbledore retrieved a pensieve-like memory
recording from Slughorn that was in part fraudulent. Arguably, Sluggy
did a poor job of covering up because he was ashamed. A more perfect
sociopath, then, might well make a better job of creating counterfit
memories. He could either sprinkle his couterfits into other wizard's
records - or, if he was a magical genius like DD, he could create a
pensieve that is entirely fiction. The magical equivalent of a muggle
accountant's* "cooked books".
Dave
* Is "muggle accountant" a redundancy?

And whilst Dd's first memory from Sluggy was very clearly altered, his own,
of the evening Voldy came looking for a job, was altered far more
subtlely(sp), albeit by Voldy not Dd himself. Still, it shows memories can
be altered so there would be a question about admitting them without other
supporting evidence, anyway.

Actually, now I think about it, there were the others Voldy altered too, so
people confessed to crimes they didn't commit. I suspect that when examined
in a pensieve, they'd also not show signs of tampering.

DaveD

[Green-Eyed Chris]

Post by DaveD

Post by David Sueme

Post by Rob Strom
Snape's conversations with Dumbledore are saved in Dumbledore's
Pensieve; wouldn't that make them a public record corroborating
Harry's story of Snape's role? (In fact they are Harry's own source
for
his story of Snape's role.)

Realistically, this is surely beyond what JKR had imagined when the
book was published, just as "gay" Dumbledore was beyond the scope at
the time the last book was published.
But, playing along, I'll argue that the Pensieve is not acceptable as
evidence in court. Dumbledore retrieved a pensieve-like memory
recording from Slughorn that was in part fraudulent. Arguably, Sluggy
did a poor job of covering up because he was ashamed. A more perfect
sociopath, then, might well make a better job of creating counterfit
memories. He could either sprinkle his couterfits into other wizard's
records - or, if he was a magical genius like DD, he could create a
pensieve that is entirely fiction. The magical equivalent of a muggle
accountant's* "cooked books".
Dave
* Is "muggle accountant" a redundancy?

And whilst Dd's first memory from Sluggy was very clearly altered, his own,
of the evening Voldy came looking for a job, was altered far more
subtlely(sp), albeit by Voldy not Dd himself. Still, it shows memories can
be altered so there would be a question about admitting them without other
supporting evidence, anyway.
Actually, now I think about it, there were the others Voldy altered too, so
people confessed to crimes they didn't commit. I suspect that when examined
in a pensieve, they'd also not show signs of tampering.

That LV should have altered DD's 'occlumental' memory with a twitch
towards his pocket or later in a protected pensieve remains pure
speculation.
--
Chris

[Toon]

On Tue, 04 Dec 2007 22:02:09 GMT, "DaveD"

Post by DaveD
And whilst Dd's first memory from Sluggy was very clearly altered, his own,
of the evening Voldy came looking for a job, was altered far more
subtlely(sp), albeit by Voldy not Dd himself.

Really? Since when?

[Timothy Bruening]

Post by Sirius Kase

Post by Toon
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:04:41 -0800 (PST), Sirius Kase

Post by Sirius Kase
but they lived, whereas we don't know how Lupin died.

Unfairly. If she wanted an orphan, she could have created a whole new
family. She killed the Lupins for a plot point.

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Snape? He died trying to help Harry secretly from behind enemy lines.

Yes, he died secretly in the shack without even putting up a fight.
He did not die in glory. At the time of his death, he was hated by
both sides.
His death did have a single witness, and the epilogue suggests that he
may want to repair Snape's reputation, but I'm not sure even Harry
Potter has that much political capital.

Weren't Hermione and Ron nearby?

[Timothy Bruening]

Post by Sirius Kase
I was fully expecting one of our good guys to die a glorious death,
that is where either causing much damage to the bad guys or saving
Harry or other VIP good guy. My chief candidates were Harry (while
saving everyone), Neville (while vanquishing Belatrix), or Lupin
(going one on one with Fenrir). Well, Harry and Nevile were heroic,
but they lived, whereas we don't know how Lupin died.
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Why didn't Hermione respond when Harry Potter was yelling at her to help him with the just stabbed but still alive Dobby? I believe that Dittiny could have healed Dobby. I see no reason for Hermione to not help Harry with Dobby, since I see no way for her to KNOW from several feet away that Dobby was a lost cause!

[john Szalay]

Post by Timothy Bruening

Post by Sirius Kase
So, who died the glorious death? Dobby, the elf, while saving Harry,
Hermione, Ron, Olivander, and Luna.

Why didn't Hermione respond when Harry Potter was yelling at her to
help him with the just stabbed but still alive Dobby? I believe that
Dittiny could have healed Dobby. I see no reason for Hermione to not
help Harry with Dobby, since I see no way for her to KNOW from several
feet away that Dobby was a lost cause!

Did she even have her bag with the undetectable exentsion charm with her at
the time ? I don,t think so..